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Answers to Objections About the Spirit of Prophecy

Norman McNulty


Norman McNulty

Neurologist at Southern Tennessee Regional Health System, Lawrenceburg, TN



  • January 9, 2016
    7:30 PM
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So it's been a privilege to be with you this weekend and I'm thankful for the opportunity that I've had to get to know some of you who have have not met before and my wife and I have certainly enjoyed renewing our coin tenses and it's a homecoming for her and it feels like coming home for me here I know so many of you so we've had a good time and I pray that what we've talked about this weekend will be a blessing to you as you seek to gain a deeper walk with God. Before a prayer I'm just going to remind you that we are going to have a question and answer session and a number of you have asked a lot of excellent questions I have a whole stack of them here and feel free when we come towards the end if some of you haven't had a chance to write out a question there's some yellow sticking out down the front here that you can come right questions and we'll get to many as many of them as we can before the end of our meeting this evening. So let's go ahead and bow our heads for a word of prayer and we will begin Father in heaven we thank you for this opportunity to come together one more time I thank you for this weekend that we've had to have an emphasis on The Spirit of Prophecy. And I pray that you will guide us in a special way sometimes when we deal with objections. When we deal with questions. We have to walk a fine line between placing ourselves on the doubles advantage around and and being honestly open in seeking truth and so I pray that we would be able to walk the line and that we would be able to deal with these issues without creating doubt. So I think you again for this opportunity and was as though I prayed in Jesus' name amen. You know one thing I will say as we start this last presentation. You have to be careful in how you ask questions. It is. Good to ask questions but when you say I'm going to play devil's advocate you are placing yourself on the Devil's around because when you start to think from the other side you're placing your soft on ground where you're looking at things strictly from a human perspective rather than from a spiritual perspective. So it's good to ask questions if you have questions about things like well how do I explain this as opposed to intentionally playing the other side when you know the side you're playing is wrong so there's keep that in mind but we're going to deal now with answers to objections about the spirit of prophecy and I'm going to deal with. She were three main areas. Depending on how much time we have and then there's a number of excellent questions that I want to make sure we have time to get through so we're definitely going to spend some time with the questions and you're going to want to hear the questions some well thought out questions from students and from perhaps others. And so we'll deal with a few areas. That are common objections to the spirit of prophecy and I will deal with some of the questions let me say this. Most of them it's most of the resources I used for this last presentation comes from the book by Francis de nickel and titled Ellen G.Y. and her critics how many of you have seen them. Some of you many of you if you have questions that is the book to read and it's very objective and it goes through all of the issues and if I had known of the book. Before I found that website twenty years ago when I was in college it would have saved me a few troublesome days of wondering what is going on here and all of those questions I've already been answered so. The fur is a wall so that for sure we're going to deal with the issue of plagiarism where people claim that she plagiarized and then we also may spend a little bit of time on the shut door theory and also perhaps on the issue of amalgamation of man and beast there's so many other things people will check out but those are some of the big areas that people talk about and perhaps I'm dealing with these issues because it goes back to my experience of being a college student and those were three of the main areas that that particular individual's picking on let me read to you. Then this is from F.T. Nichols' book and this is the charge as it relates to plagiarism in the writings of L. and Y. and I think it's helpful for you to have answers for this because you may run across as if you haven't before Here's the charge uncertain of her books and this is why I copied extensively from other authors without giving credit generally without even using called quotation marks and this she pretends was all revealed to her directly from HAVE ANOTHER the charge and eighty three she published her work schedules from the life of Paul. She has large portions from a eight hundred fifty two book by Coney bear and housen and then they go on to say the great controversy is your most popular book and much of it is taken from Andrew's history of the Sabbath Wiley's history of the wall and seasoned and these history of the Reformation along with parts of your eyes Smith's book the sanctuary and James White's book Life of William Miller. And there's a few other things that are mentioned. So there are perhaps other books that some people pick out a little bit but the cheatin main books that get most of the the attention where charges of plagiarism are leveled towards Ellen White are the book sketches from the life of Paul and also. The book great controversy you know it's interesting. And this doesn't disprove this theory but one of the first persons who took the lead in making these charges was. Former add in a spastic or at the time of his that he was an ad in its path and then left. The faith by the name of D.M. can write most of you have heard of D.M. can write. Here's the funny thing. D.M. camera D.M. can write wrote a book entitled The Bible from have and. Which was the exact same title of a book written years earlier by an ad in this minister by the name of Moses hole. And if you look at the books there are large sections were can write copies Moses wholes book extensively without giving credit and uses word for word rebate and. So they can write goes after Ellen why for doing the same thing so that's interesting. Just as a as a side point so I can write some blasting Ellen why for doing such and such yet he himself clearly did that what she was accusing her of and that's irrefutable and you can see that in the book. It was put together. However let's look at this charge more carefully the split we're going to start with a great controversy so they're saying OK she copied large portions from janitor's book History of the Sabbath history of the Reformation Wiley's history of the wall and seas and by the way if you haven't read those books you should read those books I've read large portions of Wiley's book and some of them and some of Anders I haven't finished all of them but excellent reading and here's the thing. Seventy AD in this at the time the Ellen White wrote the great controversy we're clearly familiar with all of these books especially Aegean Andrew's book History of the. Which was widely read along with your rawest most books the same surely N. James White's book Life of William Miller So on those books alone. If Ellen why is trying to pull off fast one on Adam and this by quoting extensively and I put that in quotation marks extensively from books that were widely read by something I hadn't as I mean they would have immediately recognize that she was quoting from these books and the third was something wrong with it. People would have recognized this pretty quickly so it's not like she was pulling if she was referencing these books it's not like she was quoting from. Skier sources that nobody would know about and then like oh whoops they caught me now she's they're basically leveling charges against her towards books that were widely known within the administration. Jan Andrew zero Smith and James White were Seventh Day Adventists obviously now Don and Wiley were not adding us but they there are these history books are excellent now. Ellen why I had to actually encourage people to read from A and also from Wiley notice what she says this is a review in The Herald December twenty sixth eighteen eighty two see where she says as provide something to be read during these long winter evenings for those who can procure it dominates history of the reformation will be both interesting and profitable from this work we may gain some knowledge of what has been accomplished in the past and the great work of reform now Phelim white is trying to copy from a book and hoping that people won't notice that she's copied from it while at the same time encouraging people to read from it that doesn't make a lot of sense right. Like if you're trying to hide that you're copying from a book but. When you're encouraging people to read from it. Why would you do that you see a point. And then she also knew that I mean it adding this we're very familiar with why at least history of the Walton sees out in us later ship offered as a premium with a review and herald subscriptions and so this was a widely. Read book among admin us as well not to mention the other books that were mentioned. So this is what F.T. Nicol says and I think this is worth quoting from him this is in his book. Ellen G. war and her critics and this is why it must have known that her readers preachers unladylike in the denomination would see immediately that certain passages in the great controversy were not original with her in other words that she could not have thought that she was going to deceive them into thinking that the writing was holy hers and that leads on to another equally obvious conclusion. Mrs White must of felt that she had nothing dishonorable to hide in the matter of this literary borrowing and that her borrowings could be harmonized with her claims the inspiration to draw any and all us into this to draw any other conclusions than these would be equivalent to saying that in publishing the great controversy and this is why it deliberately set out to expose herself as a literary thief and prophetic You see the point. She's like saying OK read these books these are excellent books that you should be reading and then if what she's doing is dishonorable. Then she puts these quotes into the great controversy and post that out there to say that she's not a god that's obviously not what she was doing and the same thing applies to the books from the life of Paul. She says and signs of the Times February two thousand and two eight hundred eighty three page in the. On page ninety six of the volume the life of St Paul by Tony Blair in the house and I regard as a book of great merit and one of rare usefulness to the earn a student of the New Testament history. So again. Ellen why is encouraging people to read a book that critics have said that she copied largely from and my understanding is that perhaps there are seven percent of the entire book sketches from the life of Paul that has certain borrowings from the other books. We're not even talking a about more than ten percent. Did she borrow from these authors undoubtably she did and she addresses that in the introduction to the nine hundred eleven version of the great controversy you can read in her own words where she says there. Now here is the other thing in the widest there has been a very nice job of presenting this but when it comes to copyright laws and what constituted plagiarism in Elam Why today. What Ellen White did in that time was perfectly legal and there was nothing out of the ordinary with how she borrowed from other authors at that time and she makes it clear in the book great controversy in the nine hundred eleven edition. She simply says that when I found a passage from another author that perfectly stated that which would have been reveal it wiil to me and that would convey the idea. Dia Well I simply borrowed that and placed it in the book because listen Ellen why who has prophetic authority which I believe we've clearly established this weekend as she sees God speaker and as He reveals things to her if she sees something that's written down by author that fits perfectly with her understanding of what has been revealed to her to her There is no dishonor or difficulty in placing that. Into her book. Now let me place that you another way if you read the writings of Paul in the New Testament for example. Paul quotes liberally from the Old Testament. You go through the book a room as you go through the book of Hebrews and Paul is like splicing verses they gather from all over the place he's quoting songs and Isaiah and back and Genesis and you name it and he's just he's a master of scripture he was a man mighty in Scripture and sometimes he'll say as it is written in Isaiah or as the prophet Joel said or whatever it may be and I'm not saying specifically in a specific verse that he said the prophet Joel but you get the point. Sometimes he will say as the prophet Isaiah says or is this prophets. Sometimes though he's just quoting and he's not saying I quoted this from Psalms for example and he research after ten verses seven through Earth five through seven. He's quoting from Psalms Chapter forty verses seven and eight and he doesn't say I am quoting from Psalms forty verses seventy. And so if you're going to level charges of plagiarism towards Illinois just realize that Bible authors also quoted from other places and didn't always say I'm quoting from somewhere else and you may also be aware of the fact that the Book of Revelation seventy percent has illustrations or reference back to the Old Testament. So those are just the few points worth considering when it comes to the plagiarism charges I I'm just kind of answering some of the basic points the great controversy and sketches from the life of Paul or the chiming books where the charges leveled and the main point I want you to take away from that is that Ellen White was quoting from books that were widely read within Adventism at that time and which she had encouraged people to read those books so it's not like she was trying to do some mass cover up and interesting Lee can write you first start a leveling those charges out of her was someone who had quoted use the same written a book use the same title of a previous book and then quote a largely from them so just keep that in mind so the. It's the issue of plagiarism now the show Dorothy I think we have time to hit that one as well there was a time in the early Advent Maidment And right after the great disappointment where they believed that the door of probation had closed for the world. Now when you understand the parable of the ten virgins. Ellen White says that parable has been and will be fulfilled to the vetter very letter but it continues to be present truth from that day to this some ministries of gone to town with that comparison and make themselves the modern or right movement and come up with all sorts of interesting speculative ideas that are not very helpful but. It is true that the Miller Right Movement was a fulfillment of that parable on lies. And it is true that a door was shut and you can see this in Revelation Chapter three it in the message to the Philadelphia church were God as I have closed the door that no man can open and I've shut a door. I've shut a door that no man can open and I've closed anywhere I'm a singer but you know what I mean they're open and that's all you need to know them. And that's Jesus moving from the Holy Place to the most holy place I should have open my Bible there sort of. And so it is true that Ellen White was among the early Miller right believers after the great disappointment who believed that the door of probation had closed for the world and in the parable to the ten versions. It says The door was shut. So while the foolish virgins went out to buy the bridegroom came and they that were ready went with went in with him to the marriage and the door was shut after word came. So the other version saying Lord Lord open to us and he said Verily I say and you I know you not so they're saying OK the door shut for probation for the world on October twenty two that was a belief among certain of the miller rights and Ellen White was among those who believed that but you know Ellen why it was not a prophet yet when she believed so there was a difference right. She never claimed in this isn't that the door shut for the entire world. She never wrote that but she did write in her writings that the door of probation did close for some not for everyone as they originally had believed but for some and she says in this is review and Herald January fourteenth one hundred thirty two I hereby testify in the fear of God that the charges of these brother and who are saying I taught this are not true with my brother and sisters a through the time passed and forty four I did believe no more sinners would be converted but I never had a vision that no more sinners would be converted and I'm clear and free to state no one has ever heard me say or has read from my pen statements which will justify them in the charges they have made against me upon this point it was on my journey east to relate my visions of the precious light in regard to the heavenly sanctuary was opened before me and I was shown the open and shut door. We believe that the Lord was soon to come in the clouds of heaven I was shown that there was a great work to be done in the world for those who have had not had the light and rejected it and she goes on to say certain things she says I saw that and forty forgot to open the door no man could shut it and shut a door no man could open it. Those who rejected the light which was brought to the world by the message of the second angel went into darkness and how great was that or concern other words those who specifically rejected the light the door was shut for them so there's other things that we could say about. The shut door bit. It's basically a non issue you people try to say that she taught in her writings that the door of probation had shut for the entire world and she says very clearly in the state of that I just ready that as a prophet as a messenger of the Lord. She never taught such a thing she believed it before she had her first version but that is a big difference because before her first vision she was not a prophet right. It was only after she had a vision that she became a proper for the Lord and at that point she gained clarity on that in the in a as a prophet she never taught such a thing won't see her we doing on time so I think we can hit the issue of the amount of emission of man and beast and then we'll have time to get into some of the questions that have been asked and there was a lot of excellent questions that have been asked so the charge about the some out how many of you have heard of this issue of the nation a man to be so let's deal with this here's the charge mischa's Mrs White teaches before the flood and also afterward men cohabitate it with beasts and that the offspring constitute certain deprived races of men today she is here simply revealing a credulous belief in ancient myths regarding strange creatures produced by an unholy alliances between human beings and beast. If progeny could result from such unions. It would support the anti-political doctrine of evolution but it is an unscientific statement wholly fanciful later on she suppressed the statement so what of this. Well first of all the only passages in Mrs White's writings that are ever cited in support of the charger found and spiritual gifts Volume three published in eight hundred sixty four and republished and Spirit of Prophecy Volume one in eight hundred seventy the earlier volume is the devoted to recital of the story of man's early history beginning at creation and this is where the what the statement if there was one sin above another which call for the destruction of the race by the flood. It was the base crime of amalgamation of man and beast which deface the image of God and. Cause confusion everywhere. God's purpose to destroy by a flood that powerful long lived a race that had corrupt of their ways before him and then that spiritual guess well in three page sixty four and then later on in the next chapter she says every species of animal which God had created were preserved in the ark the confused species which God did not create which were the result of amalgamation were destroyed by the flood since the flood there has been amalgamation of man and beast as may be seen in the almost endless varieties of species of animals and in certain races of men so those are the statements that critics say that she is saying that man and beast came together but is that really what she sang. So these are Mrs White's only statements on the subject what Mrs White and them by these passages has been the occasion of some speculation through the years and certainly her critics have tried to make a lot ahead this. Mrs White speaks of two clearly distinguished group so let's look at this Mrs White speaks of Chu clearly distinguished groups that testify to the same allegation there are one species of animals and she races of men there is no suggestion and this is enough the nickel's worth I find this to be very helpful there is no suggestion that there were species part man on par animal she never says that. But how could there be amalgamated of man with an animal and the result be anything else than hybrid man animal species. She does not even a hint of subhuman monsters or caricature of man on the here on tree as just noted she speaks on equivocally of species of animals and races of men that's the first point point on which you miss is why it speaks of the animals in most Ferrari's of species of animals that have resulted from amalgamation now the standard attack on this is why in the matter of amalgamation as that she reflected the thinking of those who believe the fiction of Manimal animal crosses of we rightly understand. That fiction as has been as it has been wafting through the centuries by the ones of credulity a lar a few large mythical creatures of antiquity were supposed to have resulted from a union of man with animals and so on but Mrs White really wasn't it's pressing this really if you're looking at this. And this is really just a lesson in the English language she says amalgamation of man and beast. And she's basically saying that species of animals amalgamated or cross. You're basically mixed and then she also said that about men but it would be a stretch based on reading everything that she says here to say that she was claiming that man and beast in the next That's my understanding then and you know people are always going to look for reasons to question the spirit of prophecy but I mean if that's the best that you can throw at me. You've got to do a better job than that. Like I'm going to give up my belief in the visions that God gave her that clearly came in a divinely appointed way because you're going to split hairs on amalgamation of man and beast versus I'm out of commission of man with Beast and she didn't say man with B. She said Man envies. To me. People will look for reasons to not believe that I choose the believe because things like that don't shake me at all and I mean to me there is clearly a clear explanation as to what she meant the issue of plagiarism. She followed the standard during her time she wasn't following the standard of twenty sixteen she lived in the eighteen hundred in the early one thousand nine hundred and she followed what was standard practice for her time and she encouraged people to read the books that she quoted from so it's not like she was trying to cover something up and the shut door theory she has made it very clear that yes personally she believed in such a should or before be she became a profit. But after God gave her vision she saw very clearly what that concept and killed and then the issue of the American nation of man and beast. She's not stating the man and beast next but that there was a Malcolm nation of animals amalgamation of man now. I'm going to go through some of these questions that have come through and if if any of you want to ask questions as well there's still this paper in time write it down and I'll pick them up and we still have plenty of time and I think you're going to find these questions perhaps even more interesting than the issues that we've dealt with so far. So I am greatly appreciative for the questions that have been asked and if you have other questions. You can come. There's these yellow sticky notes down here up front and if you have questions you can write them down and we will we will go through it that way that's the format that we're going to follow so if you have a question. Write it down and we will address that and then if I still don't answer I'll be happy to talk with you afterwards so that's the approach we're going to follow so the first question. Is what is the balance of using scripture in the spirit of prophecy. When preaching or presenting to others example you know how many quotes of L N Y versus the Bible very good question now and I'll mention this you know because this was a spirit of prophecy week and I understand that the majority of what I was quoting you was from the Spirit of Prophecy and yes I did have some Bible passages but mostly from the Spirit of Prophecy but I certainly encourage the majority of what is presented to be from the Bible with supporting statements from the. From the writings of L. and why I know that I've preached some sermons recently where I don't think I had any quotes from the Spirit of Prophecy but usually I have at least the. But I always try to make sure that the Bible is the foundational framework for for the thrust of the message that I'm giving and so I hope that you will come away from the understanding with an understanding this weekend that the Bible is paramount. It's the greater light the spirit of prophecy is the lesser light it's the same source of inspiration but really the Bible is where we lay are foundation so you know I would encourage laying your you know if you start off a sermon try to lay the foundation from the Bible and bring support of course and from the spirit of prophecy as you can. And of course you know let the Spirit lead but yeah. Definitely use plenty of Bible. Now and this is an interesting question. How long should one remember remain a seventy AD and some member while they blatantly disregarded confess unbelief in the spirit of prophecy. Now that's a tough question an interesting question but I would say this you know the belief in the spirit of prophecy is one of the fundamental beliefs of the seventh and the church because of what the Bible says if you in your conscience and not believe in the writings of Ellen why. The honest thing to do would not to be a Seventh Day Adventists like why would you stay in the Seventh Day Adventist Church and try to convince people to not believe in L N Y one let me tell you something there are always going to be Seventh Day Adventists who believe in Ellen why we're not going away. We're going to stay in the church and we're going to continue to support her so if you're not in support of the Spirit of Prophecy. If it's something that you feel strongly that she's not inspired than really the honest thing to do would be to step away but I might add and I hasten to add. I hope that after you've been here this weekend that your heart has been softened if you had a belief in that you would choose to come back to a belief in her writings. OK now this is an interesting question we may spend a couple minutes on this very good question it says is The World Church wrong and voting down women's ordination based on the fact the spirit of prophecy speaks of women being pastors she speaks of this in Cole Porter ministry and price object lessons excellent question and I'm going to read to you now the statement that you were referencing and we are going to see what the Spirit of Prophecy says on the IF SHE at hand and I'm not even going to. Knesset will I mean I'll point you to first some of the chapter three. For further study that's where we go to in the Bible let me read you well and why it's essence you're saying well why it says that women can be pastors So let's see what Ellen wants. And this is also found not only in. Cole Porter ministry it's Or originally in testimonies for the church volume six page three twenty two it's also in review and Herald January fifteenth one thousand one hero we read all who desire an opportunity for true ministry and who will give themselves unreservedly to God will find in the canvassing work opportunities to speak upon many things pertaining to the future immortal life and the experience of the Savan will be of the greatest value to those who are fitting themselves for the ministry. Now here's the key sentences is the accompaniment of the Holy Spirit of God that prepares workers both men and women to become pastors to the flock of God. Oh well that sells them when men and women to become pastors to the flock of God Now if you notice the sentence as the that proceeded it's hawked about the true ministry being found in canvassing work opportunities and so the context. Strongly suggest that being pastors of the flock of God comes in the canvassing work and she goes on to say that you will learn how to pray as you work and you'll be educated in patients on us affability and helpfulness as you do canvassing work and I'm sure those of you who have done that have found that to be true. Now as she also says in Riviera labor for eight hundred two if there is one word more one working war important than another it is that of getting before the public our publications which will lead men to search the Scriptures Now if you're getting before the public or publications that's canvassing work and she goes on to say missionary work introducing our publications into families conversing and praying with and for them is a good work and one which will educate men and women to do pastoral labor. So again the context of this thing as well as the previous one strongly suggest that this pastoral labor that men and women are called to do is the work of canvassing now she has some other statements besides the ones that I just read that clarify this a very strongly because I can tell you that those who pushed wrongly the idea of women's ordination. To. Positions of headship within the ad in this urge used the quotes that I just read to convey the idea strongly that Ellen White support of the ordination of women to the pastoral ministry but notice now what she says and testimonies volume five page sixty the primary object of our call a judge was to afford young men an opportunity to study for the ministry and to prepare young persons of both sexes to become workers in the various branches of the cause. And as you hear that. So for men. It's an opportunity to study for the ministry. And to and for young persons of both sexes to become workers in the various branches of the cause us to someone is Volume five page sixty in then and volume five page five ninety seven she says those who enter the missionary field should be men and women who walk and talk with God and those who stand as ministers in the sacred desk should be men of blameless reputation. You see the difference she's making so sometimes he'll say Oh well I'm wise as men and women can be pastors of the flock of God But if you read the context and by the way context is important. The context makes it very clear that the pastoral work she is speaking of is canvassing board but when she speaks of the ministry. She says those who stand as ministers in the sacred desk should be men of blameless reputation and earlier she says the primary object of her college. Was to afford young men an opportunity to study for the ministry and to prepare young persons of both sexes to become workers in the various branches of the cause so that's a case of simply letting all of the testimony speak for themselves for example if all you had it was from the third angels message and by the way this is found in the third angel's message the smoke of their torment ascended forever and ever That's the third angel's message but we use all of the Bible to understand that. That's higher. The fire that destroys the wicked Revelation chapter twenty verse nine godsons fired from God out of heaven and of ours the wicked. And that way could become stubble as the Old Testament describes and the scripture describes of Lucifer that never shall be any more we put all of that together and we understand that the results of that fire are you. Colonel but they are not tormented eternally so sometimes you just have to put everything together and there's that one statement want to see statements were talks about men and women as pastors but you understand that's in the context of canvassing work that ministers in the sacred dust. She refers to specifically as men and within that same passage says men and women can do various lines of work but it's men in the Sacred this. OK. Let's look at a few other things OK this is a good question does Ellen White and the bible contradict each other on the subject of Christmas. Well I've heard some say that the book of easy keel. And it's a Sri that's related to Tammy's and it's pagan and all of that but you have to ask yourself the question when you speak of an evergreen tree when I first of all when I drive down the road and I see a cedar tree who made that cedar tree to Tammy's make that cedar tree and. You know how far are we going to go back are we going to say that pagans and Tammy's have a monopoly on an evergreen tree or are we going to say that God who created the evergreen tree is the one who made it so not as well and why it says about a Christmas tree and have an out honest home page for each show we have a Christmas tree god would be well pleased if an owner is she says he would be well please if on Christmas each church would have a Christmas tree on which shall be hung offerings great and small for these houses of worship letters of inquiry have come to us asking Shall we have a Christmas tree will it not be like the world we answer you can make it like the world if you have a disposition to do so or you can make it as unlike the world as possible there is no particular sin in selecting a fragrant fragrant evergreen and placing it in are sure. It was about the symbolizing the motive which prompts the action and the use which is made of the gifts placed upon the tree the tree may be as tall as branches as wide as shall best suit the occasion but let us about as be laden with the gold and silver fruit of your been enough a sense and present this to him as your Christmas gift. Let your donations be sanctified by prayer Christmas and New Year celebrations can and should be held in behalf of those who are helpless God as glorified when we give to help those who have large families to support. So not to she says you know our Christmas we should be using this as a time to help those who are in need and we should use it as a time to give thanks offerings to God and in fact God would be well pleased them by the way when she says this is making it very clear that no you are not committing a crime of paganism by offering a thing offering to God on Christmas. You know sometimes we can become a bit extreme when we try to separate ourselves from the world and I'll say this I was in a place one time and I won't say where and I won't say when and where the way. Some of the people that I was with the way they were doing a certain reform and I want to even say what it was was so beyond a way along why even so as that when they would give messages from the pulpit which were good. The people were afraid that if they accepted what was being said from the pulpit then eventually they would have to do what the people were doing externally and it was so beyond what inspiration even says that it turned people off the have to be careful when you start going down the anti-Christmas route that when you go beyond what even Ellen whites is that you can make Chris. Scheana to be an attractive and looks there are certain things that God has clearly called us to turn away from that if we're going beyond what God has called us to turn away from then we can make Christianity in Adventism into an unpleasant experience for all and we don't want them. Alright. This was a question about plagiarism which I think we addressed. Here's a good question this is how do you show or prove Revelation one nine hundred ten that says of the. Brother in that how the testimony of Jesus worshipped God for the testimony of Jesus of the Spirit of Prophecy that the testimony of Jesus is The Spirit of Prophecy or know that the testimony of Jesus and the Spirit of Prophecy is elements writings as well as the Bible and not solely the Bible some people refer to this verse as the Gospels or Bible prophets now you bring up a good point now we talked about this in our sermon today Revelation twelve seventeen and you should get your Bibles out if you have it. Revelation twelve seventeen says that the remnant church has the testimony of Jesus Christ in Revelation nineteen then tells us that the testimony of Jesus is The Spirit of Prophecy but in the part of the verse before it so the testimony of Jesus is The Spirit of Prophecy. John is about to fall at the feet of this Angela worship him and the angel says don't worship me I am of your fellow servant and of your brother and who have the testimony of Jesus worship God for the testimony of Jesus is The Spirit of Prophecy. Then in Revelation twenty two eight nine a same. Very similar scene. John is about to fall down at the feet of the angel to worship the angel and the angel says don't do it for I am your fellow servant and of your brother and instead of saying who have the testimony of Jesus he says I am of your fellow brother and or I am of you and your fellow servant of your brother in the prophets and of them which keep the sayings of this book worship God So in other words the testimony of. Yes this is the Spirit of Prophecy. Which means it is the prophetic gift if one has the testimony of Jesus. It means they are a prophet. Now I will certainly clarify that I am not saying that L N Y is the only one who has had the testimony of Jesus every profit throughout the history of scripture and even those there are certain prophets that scripture talks about who didn't write in the canon of scripture any prophet has the testimony of Jesus but in Revelation twelve seventeen it was that in God the last the remnant church they have Shuki identifying characteristics they keep the commandments of God and I remember when the advent movement came out of the scene they came out of the scene of Christianity where all the Christian churches were worshipping on the first day of the week and God says Remember the seventh day because he knew the world would forget it and as he went to the most holy place he needed to raise up a movement. That would call the world to remember the seventh day as the Sabbath and he also showed that there would be within the midst of that remnant church the testimony of Jesus which is the spirit of prophecy which is the prophetic gift so there would be a prophet in the remnant church and when you follow the test of the prophet. It's a lot of the testimony they speak not according to this word it is because there is no light in them. Ellen White clearly speaks to the light of the Bible and she clearly points people to Jesus and clearly that what she is for told is come to pass. So basically my responses the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy that applies to any prophet throughout the history of the service and in the remnant church in the last days especially applies Chu Ellen White but we recognize the every prophet in Scripture has the testimony of Jesus. At once. See here wasn't our all just his reading the councils of L. and why it helps you in the work that you do you are you are there incidents were non standard by the knowledge that you you've learned prior to your neurology experience is a great question you know clearly as a Seventh Day Adventists physician I have an advantage of that non ad in this physicians can't understand. Now there are certain things that are just common sense like being nice to your patients when they come in to see you. You'd be amazed how many rude doctors there are who think they can get by with being grumpy and gruff and rude and mean and sure and they tend to be in the surgical specialties but anyway so it seems to somehow attract that kind of personality and I know some very nice or it is not get me wrong and somehow. People with a main disposition and they go that route but there is certainly something to be said for having a Christ like disposition as you interact with your patients and as you enter into. You know the bedside of a patient the hospital he's sick or who comes in your twenty's and they are worried about whatever the whatever they may have and they're wondering what's wrong with them when you can bring into that room. A disposition a Christian disposition that puts them at peace and puts them at ease and they understand that you know what you're talking about because like if you go into medicine gods not looking for below average doctors who barely get by that's not a good witness. You want to do all that you do to the glory of God but there is also something to be said for mining knowledge where the Spirit of Christ and with the advent of. Advantage of the health message that we have and so certainly explaining to people the relationship of health and of lifestyle and diet with their health issues. You know I don't know how many times people say well my doctors and never told this to me before you know they've been to their primary doctor and sometimes their primary doctor is hopelessly overweight. I've had people tell me you know my overweight doctor told me I needed to lose weight so I never went back to see them again. So. And I understand some people have struggles in those areas and I understand that myself but certainly we have an ad in the van and we want to live up to the light in the council that we have and when you can combine that as a visit physician. It certainly is powerful so if God is calling some of you into medicine. Be serious about that call and just realize that God isn't calling you into medical mercenary word. It's a medical missionary word. So just remember that. Here is another thing about Christmas trees I think we've already answered that. OK this is good. Are there are some things in L M Y S writings that refer to things that are meant for our times such as a bicycle and bathing and that kind of thing. OK So let's talk about the bicycles. You know if you go to Wal-Mart and buy a bicycle you can get one for one hundred dollars I don't know it's something like that one hundred to two hundred dollars and depending on how you save money and things of that nature. If you're going to use a bicycle to get around the campus here for whatever you're doing that's a reasonable cost. Compared to how much money you would spend for like a Mercedes or a Lamborghini right. Like if you go and you're a faculty member here. Watch avails and you roll in with a Lamborghini. Yeah that's going to be a like what. Are you doing here I mean it is just a Lamborghini isn't washer the whole just don't fit right. And I want to add I wouldn't let me say I would never ever expend that much money on a car. OK. Right that's stupid. You know how many people. Should be saved to the kingdom of God with the money that I spent on that Lamborghini that I could have spent on a choice on a Camry right. OK So when Ellen why you spoke of the bicycle is she bicycles were a brand new thing and actually Dr Clark and I were just talking about this last night bicycles were a brand new thing. And what was that a half years wage that they were spending on. Yeah. So they were spending one hundred fifty dollars which was a half here is wage. So whoever you are if you're going to spend a half years wage on transportation and these are people that especially in the Lord's work. You understand this if you're not making huge sums of money to then go out and spend money on the way to add that is a tremendous expenditure. That's well and what was talking about now shortly after that the prices of bicycles came down and so if you're to go to Wal-Mart and spend a hundred dollars on a bicycle in our day and age one hundred dollars compared to one hundred fifty dollars each you know one hundred fifty years ago is very different but the principle is if you show up to watch the hills in a Lamborghini you get the. Right you would be getting a testimony from Sister Y. about the purchase of your Lamborghini. And the witness that it creates that your treasure is here on this earth not in heaven and that's what she was speaking of now the issue of bathing she encouraged people to take baths before Sabbath of at all possible and the reason being is that there was so much effort expended in she. Getting the water ready and are there any thing else. Getting the water ready for the bath I mean that it was a big ordeal and you know the interesting thing is with all the work that was involved in. Preparing a bath. They were able to do it before sundown hours you know how easy it was to get a bath before Sabbath now. So if they could do it when it was so hard back then why is it so hard for us now just think about them. So it's all right. Now this is a very good question as a doctor what is your stance on Ellen White's counsel on avoiding drugs and drug use how should we interpret those that seem all encompassing not just in the context of the harmful drugs of her day and that is a great question you ever ask. And it certainly as a physician I do prescribe medication. And the question is you know how do we understand I wanted to counsel on the proper or improper use of what she called Drugs what we call medication today Well first of all I would say that there were very few if any drugs in her. I'm that word good. When you're talking about strychnine arsenic. I mean. Have mercy of the fleas awful. That's that's the first thing I'll say and nobody in good conscience today is prescribing arsenic or strychnine now she does pacifically condemn morphine as a medication that is harmful and addictive and that is a medication that in my practice I do not prescribe. Because of its addictive properties as a narcotic and people yet hooked on it. But she also in a period of time where her she and her family were going to be exposed potentially to malaria. They went ahead and and took quinine. So it wasn't like she never used. What you would call drugs or medication because malaria is fatal many times in fact I know of a young lady here almost died from malaria a few years ago. And she's someone who is the G Y C now and. You know so in that instance Ellen White says you have to do the best you can. So I do believe that most of the time medication is overprescribed and that people rely on medication to be their fix rather than getting to the root of the problem and I talk about this with my patients that. You can't go to the Hill the fix your underlying problem when your underlying problem is bad choices in lifestyle. So you've got to fix the bad underlying elem. Once and don't expect a pill to fix your problem the other thing is that there are many medications today that are plant based that were around in her day so I am not as concerned about certain plant based medications that are available you may understand the aspirin comes from the bark of a willow tree. So you could call that a natural remedy. So just keep that in mind that. Do I believe that medication is overused and overprescribed Yes and especially in the area of narcotics and that is something that I L. My gives clear counsel on and we want to make sure that we're following that when it comes to like vaccines and you know taking on why and her family took quinine before potential exposure to malaria they'd circuit. So just keep that in mind that was an excellent question very very good. Let's see are we doing on time to finance time to go through some more of these it was another bicycle question we talked about. Oh this is a good question how would you deal with this you were convicted on something and then your family thinks you are being too scrupulous and over anxious Well you know without knowing what the issue is make sure you're not being overscrupulous. Or overanxious. I mean I have known of. All mention this and I'll get to the root of the issue I mean I I need someone one time you had a bit of O.C.D. and if a pencil dropped on the floor they would use to shoot paper to pick it up so they wouldn't get germs. Their hands. Now I'm assuming you're not referring to that bit. You can be a bit shoe scrupulous and I would use that as an illustration that you're using tissue paper to pick up a pencil this on the floor because you're afraid you're going to get germs on your hand that would be an illustration of being too scrupulous right. But on the other hand if you're convicted that the seventh day is the Sabbath and your family thinks that that is ridiculous and you know from the Bible that you need to follow the seventh day of the Sabbath the Bible makes it very clear he who loves father or mother more than the is not worthy of me if you're convicted on the light of the Sabbath or perhaps a lie on another doctrinal area or maybe it's an area of standard where you're going back to the Hey my family is eating me and I want to become a vegetarian I want to become a vegan and they're saying Man you're being too scrupulous and you're like now I'm going to follow what the Bible says I want to follow with the spirit of prophecy says then you can be nice about it you can be a lobbing about it now I hope you wouldn't be like some people could be where when you go home for Christmas and you sit down at the table you're like oh no you're serving chicken to us again don't you know what shaken Hausen are. And then you wonder why they don't want to hear anything that you have to say. But when the chicken play is passed around you just politely say no thank you and then at a later time you share why in a Christ like way that's the best that I can answer that question but I would say if it's something that's clear from inspiration that you're convicted on you're not being too scrupulous you're not being overanxious but if you're only convicted that you need to leave your house to fifty degrees at all times so that you can have proper circulation when your family might have a point. So just it depends on what the issue is and I believe it or not I've seen. Both situations in my life among various people. All right the few a few other things. Your statement about some of them on my Ghana following all the council they had sometimes it can seem impossible to be a big God to does not ask us to do things that cannot be accomplished things will. So it's sort of a question answer. Within the thing you can't answer the question. But just remember again yes sometimes while following everything that God has asked us to do you but you know as Ellen White says and price object lessons all of God's a bit in these are enabling. So if you look at something as a promise rather then I have to need this. So I go praise the Lord I don't have to eat the food anymore. You know then it's a bedding from God that he's going to enable you to do you. And it's not going to be so hard for you. To do. OK a few other questions do you think that spicy food is harmful or even sinful according to Ellen what you know Ellen White makes it very clear that we should avoid spicy food right. And why does she say that. Usually Now there's various spices of course and then agree as one of their issues and I think sentiment as well that she talks about and I can tell you as a physician that those things those Venator sentiments are things are harmful to the lining of your stomach and you know people can make fun of. Some of these ideas but. There is also a thing called Heartburn the any ever ever heard of heartburn gastroesophageal reflux disease and so they're eating all sorts of spicy food and then they're on Protonix your own map resolve crevice. Or you name it all these proton pump inhibitors next see and then there's the water is like written Idina or same at a teen and. But then the medication can give you a bit of a bad taste so the fear that you enjoyed so much now doesn't taste as good because you're on proton pump inhibitors so that your reflexes and so bad so yeah. Keep them on. Alright are we doing. Now this is a medical question what do you know about hydrocephalus this isn't really of any particular spiritual value. Hydrocephalus is a condition in the brain where there may be a blockage or some kind of a pressure buildup where the venture goals. Inside the brain that contain the super cerebral spinal fluid become in large and as they become a large you have a feeling of pressure and oftentimes you'll have headaches and depending on the type of hydrocephalus you have sometimes you may even need to have a shunt to drain the fluid off. But that's a medical issue and sometimes it comes up and if you have that you would need to have it dealt with now that in the elderly there's a condition called Normal Pressure Hydrocephalus which is associated with memory loss here in area incontinence and. Magnetic gate and I'll be testing you on the. On your next question on to me. But you know for the for those of you who are young you don't need to worry about that. But yeah if you have hydrocephalus I would not leave it with because it can cause long term complications that can be avoided if you treat it. Appropriately so that's basically. I think all of the questions for now so if you have any other questions that I didn't answer. You have to be happy to talk to you afterwards. Why don't we. Yeah. If someone has a question they can come talk to me that's fine. So why don't we go ahead and on. This forest possible Neal for prayer. Father in heaven we thank you for bringing us here this weekend and we thank you for this opportunity that we have had she spend some time reflecting on the gift of prophecy that you have given to your church. Lord I pray that as you know as we reflect on this weekend as the thing the things that we've talked about I pray that we would not be like Brother Stevens and the two was convicted of the truth of the Spirit of Prophecy but he resisted it and twenty seven years later found out what his life had them why and he could have avoided it help us to follow your counsel and to be happy and joyful in the Lord following the counsel that you've given to us we pray that we would be on the Lord's side and accept her writings understanding that you have spoken through here in these last days. Help us to have a proper understanding of her authority in our church help us to use your writings properly help us do not need to. Discourage by criticisms or charges that are out there that can be easily answered and and and as we face personal issues in our lives whatever it may be maybe we have questions about. Various standards or what we should be doing whatever it may be may we follow what the Bible says May we follow with the testimony of Jesus. And may we be found faithful when you. So I thank you for this opportunity that we've had to reflect on the gift of prophecy and each one of us. That on her death she said we know whom we believe every day ever lives until Jesus comes. I pray this in Jesus' name. This media was brought to you by audio from a website dedicated to spreading God's word through free sermon audio and much more if you would like to know more about audio. If you would like to listen to more service Visit W W W or.


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