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Logo of 2016 Michigan Camp Meeting: The Harvest is Great

Godhead Questions and Answers- Part 1

Daniel Scarone

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  • June 12, 2016
    9:30 AM
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OK. Good afternoon everyone good to see. What we were doing in the in the afternoon is. Do are kind of cool and I regarding the topic of the Godhead in the Bible saw it today in the morning I received one question but if you have any other for tomorrow is going to help me. To build up the topics Anyhow I'm going to share some of the questions I already received from from several other places in which we were basically in the Guardian days that the topic of of the Trinity that is in these small men one critical issue that is affecting the chart in the morning we are talking about the pioneers of the Seventh Day Adventist charge on their position regarding the evolving I will say. Three to create area regarding the Trinity or the god. In the afternoon we are going to be working a little bit about question and answers and let's have a word of prayer. We'll have a couple of pastors today and I would request the pastor of Richardson to do the the prayer for us. I really thank you so much. You know. OK. One of the questions that. That normally comes. Regarding the award Trini. Trini T. and today I received. One of these questions and. The word trinity was also say use by parents in the Treaty of Feiss Horace and said and the sign of all of these worn by the pulpit and what this here is. Is this monogram if I. It's this. In a circle. Either way this is. This is not the Regarding the Trinity. This is regarding. The load the Lord Jesus uses who stops and. Normally. Of of the eeks of Jesus yes is finished to us and by the way in the timing which I used to be. At our board and when I was a key. It was printed by seal in the wall for in the in the Catholic Mass in those days you know so the meaning was that in the moment that. The person is receiving the communion. Receiving the bother. The ball the day. And the blogger of the Lord Jesus in that instant moment of of taken it saw. I do have. A very. A serious observation regarding the topic because. They cut policies in general I think that in the moment in which they. The pris finish the depression year of the consecration of of of that war for I've done moment in that piece a small piece of bread stop being that to begin to be of the body and the blog of the Lord Jesus and they called that translucency Asian That isa transformation in the nature of the they were for so we don't believe that and that is that is not. Our normal practice or understanding inside our our child but but all the while first they do have this. In sealed you know it is imprinted very clearly so let me explore. And I guess that with one of you today I share one view regarding the the Trinity somebody made. A comment regarding my book and this is in the in this magazine coming from General Conference. By the way limits stop here for a moment I'm not used to do that but it's good to do it from time to time this Miocene. If you are student university or so you might be able to receive it. No student. And I guess it for free by the way and everybody sometimes is interested in receiving something for free and. He was doing some kind of critique of the book. And he said this is a book this is about this book. This is a book about the Trinity though it is not all views in that title two chapters use the term Trey unity and by the way is true I when you go inside the book you are going to see that we were discussing with Pacific press about how we are going to to call because my. Personal preference at the beginning was to use got him regarding the topic why because it is very clear and neat in the in the New Testament is is in the in the book of Colossians the Apostle Paul is referring to you know not to give a name of of the entire divinity and unseen Vaal than all the persons in the evening so. I have been inclined to but when you are writing a book and you are using sometimes the term several times you need to look for. An alternative and try unity was an option so he said this two chapters use a turn tray unity common among And he's by lingua So he says English language others and like to say it doesn't refer to US guys who are in the other part of the war that is the meaning of that such avoidance of the term Trinity oh so much to the fact that the Oneness of God is so clear in the Bible that some people cringe at the side of the term that has three minutes three meters in the lot in they do not need to be Warry Trinity he says. Lety. It does not need to be capitalized. It means that there are there is some scene three like about God not that God this tree I say again this. It means that there is something free like about dark and not that God East three by the way when we use the concept of the Trinity we are not believe in in three gods. We are believing in one God. And I'm going to if you need I'm going to give some some examples of you. Could you could you write of questions if let me listen to this with everybody I'm going to share some. Some paper if you have any question to more I'm going to take some time so also for for doing some. Questions Yes I am answering this question that I received today in the morning. No two more I'm going to our answer your question. I just owners. Because I need to review the question and. I know you understand but if you don't mind I'm going to play anyhow. I I do prefer to get the question in written because I do have a proof of the question and I'm having the Tx us a proof I'm going to deal with the question even in your text and that is better for me and and and I I'm working with a program regarding question and answers and sometimes I use it in in that context and. So I suppose that you have a good question like everybody. Saw Let's go ahead with this dream it is a quality does not need to be capitalize it means that there is something in three like about dog not that there are these three he's just one. And I do have an example of this and in the Bible you're going to find out that when the Apostle Paul is finishing for example the pistol to the. He's talking about ONE GOD I haven't at the end he says and mention the Father the Son and the Holy Spirit. But when you go to verse eleven and finish in the thirteen you're going to see that he's referring to the same topic so he's not changing the views of that he says that it's important to taking count and. He says a little bit more one when we speak about the unity of something that thing is usually not really one the unity of the nation for example the unit of the charge or anything is composed of more than one subject but that in some respects is or should be like one. That that is part of the problem that I discuss in one of the topics that I present in the book. And. By the way. We are not the only people that believe what believe and there are others who share our Were beliefs regarding some of these topics and even when we have some kind of. And or differences among us however our Jewish people they tend to believe in One God you know however when you go to them turn only chapter six burst for you remember you you have your Bible there. Due to a nominee up to six verse for. The to Romney Chapter six verse four. You have it. You have it. It's a set listen of Israel or here or Israel. The law or. Our God the Lord. Is one so it's not. So one one of the things that. Hold my attention doing. Doing reading and reviewing that is first of all the three times that appears the name of the Lord three times. Listen or hear always right of the Lord first time. Our God. The Lord. Is one. Three times appears. One of the things. No nos. OK. Here we have three times. However two names of God in the order. One nice way or other Now I read time that appears are now I or. It is written why H. Why hate Oh hey why you are going to find out that East called the theater Rama that most Socrate a holy name of God in the Old Testament because there is NEVER use for any other divinity in the Bible. And in the in your if you are usin Well younger generations do not use any longer version and I understand you know but he's in capital letters Lord and every time every time that you find that means that in the OR easy enough that he's deter grama it means the most Socrate name of God in the Old Testament. So in my reflection I've been thinking can I say this in other way short way here. Are were lower is one. I say funny yes you can say. It. But is three times and use Elohim they screwed up by the way second time when one say's our God is L. A Him in your easy enough and use here they were a have. It have is are. These are a remember something I reflect in this. Then angrier than I have these are ward that means you need team of of all other sings inside. For example when you go to Genesis Chapter one Verse five let's go to Genesis Chapter one Verse five. That is the first time in which appears this ward in the Indonesian now and and this is just trying to clarify what we were reeling in chapter six for. Please. One flash. And. Why. When the Bible says here the first day I know the Bible says. One day or something you know use the word have and when you go to the details you are going to see that it is a kind of unity in Walden Two different manifestations of the nature one is the day light on the night. Burial of course opposite each other you know day and night but they are composed in in one day. In the in the fusion of that is one day and and that is the work they have the first time appears so it caught my attention appeal a little bit about what is the meaning here because in both the unity of two different and in certain sense opposite ways of the many for teaching of the nature because in our common dialogue we say well this is like day or night on. We are you know talking about that thing so Genesis chapter two verse twenty four. And I am please give an example no more than that given to belittle examples reality's topic chapter two verse twenty four normally. We use this in the moments in which we are marrying people in the charges you know. Is a text that we know very well you have it could you really. One Flesh one or game is a same word. So here is not day or night there laments that of the linguistic involve it but it is to person to people is a woman and a men united under the blessing of the Lord and they become in that moment a unity call by one flesh they have is a word saying Ward that appears in the tournament Chapter six where for. So long there are other elements in the Bible that you are going to find out in the book of securing the book Oh says Ress in the book in the book I am chatting with you you are going to find out some other examples but this is telling you something quite interesting respecting this topic so. And hearsays when we speak about the unity of something that's usually not really one the unity of the nation the unity of the charge or anything as composed of more than one subject but that in some respect East or should be like one it makes little sense to its peak. About the unity of a single person. If you. See the book by the way but. I'm going to give you the transliteration. Means one. Young. Converse lein when we speak about the treaty of God we are speaking about a God who East only one but who reveals inside of us three person it makes little sense to pick about the Trinity of the three. Quality of one. Say since this author the idea of oneness therefore is a stronger in the term three need to be done in the term try unity so all this is a mystery for me and I already got it. And if you want I guess he is making the point. And that is important about that so what I will say rather than that. I don't know if when we go to other divinities they are going to a speaking the same kind of sense in which we are using the concept of the treaty about the parens gods of. Or all other or other places because I guess that that is not this act meaning that we are having over there I do agree something however because if you are going to do so. Trinity is not a Biblical wart. Or of course I do agree with. What is my personal preference. Well my personal preference here is and I am not against the our charge but I was not in bogotá in any kind of consultation regarding this topic the topic appears but I already mention that my personal preference will be that God Why because it is in the Bible simple. You can write you can write the question so so that is that is my first. My first son's worth regarding this topic the other topic that I received huge year is regarding Matthew twenty eight nineteen. Months you twenty one thing. The question is this about the background of the Matthew twenty eight one thousand. There are two. Lines they got in this. Case it's true that this is not India Rhaetian else in the in the in the Bible. And I do have. I don't know what to say regarding that I'm not want to call or put kind of name for the people that are looking for argumentation against the topic of the Trinity but I will say that if you go to here and let me share with you this is the version this is the. Our New Testament in Greek and normally here in. The critical apparatus and say swear are. The sources that nurture the text OK here are all the names of the sources. And when I search in that. There is no question about. This no problem in that in the in the critique text saw I I am I am I am sharing with you what I do found by the way you go did you do you do her about that in any time about this topic. And I did not. Think. It is in the region. In the three yet that yes there is. Not. Here are the violence is OK here are the variances biases means that they suck in that text. For example father is not Son is not or Holy Spirit is not OK There is no problem in the text that in the text is like we have it. I now read that not. Yet doesn't mean which I didn't. ALTER. What a lot like you I think. You know why. Let me let me share with you let me. If Can a Greek of heart and this is the nurture of the word we have. In older version of the Bible because this is coming from biblical societies. And there is the variances. Well I am answering Tele in my perception regarding this topic because. The. Let me see here I guess I wrote some sin here. I don't know if well in the. At the beginning of. Of our class for some reason I guess. I have. A misplaced of. I had an accident with a with a with a paper OK but. OK. So basically that takes a. Dot we have to up ties in the name of the Father the song on the Holy Spirit. That is how we have in the version of the original that I do have. Of that of the Greek so in the critical operatic us there is no changes regarding dot so when somebody stealin or say in doubt I will say. I don't have any any way to corroborate that kind of thing I. Am not shocked you know people for what they say and I know that but you need to know what you are going to say at some point and when you go to this you. We're going to check for example if. There is our question sometimes those who who are there are there tell us out on what is the front lines yes the ROVs that is the translation in English. And still last and into last it's a little different in meaning remember something in those days when they were copying the Bible they were are listening in somebody's reading still last in total last sounds like to say but is not the same meaning one means commandements and the other means ropes OK so if you catch up and you are not without a new kind of little machine for listening Well you know like they provide here if you have any any problem you are going to catch up the wrong ward and you are going to put that change in the text you are you understand what I'm saying. And that that appears here in the Book of Revelation and say well. Here's means. The maturity of the texts are telling this that that is not the case of Matthew twenty eight nineteen besides. And. And with certain her I'm going to use this elenchi why use that version seven times in her writings. She never Richen about that she knew or mentioned that was doubtful that or something so if you. They're going to take this text out of the Bible you're going to be in certain difficulties and in a sense why because for example the that Cain that is one of their early writings in the times and this is not in the Bible did a case not in the Bible did a kid and he's the teaching in all of the Twelve Apostles is. Apocrypha book but very early in the in the times of of the charge are probably some people say says from the first century about and close to. Apostolic times they use and mention uncooled this same scene and seven other times they are with quotation of the book of Matthew into these acts so we need to be sometimes with her fullness in the way we are. In with this regarding this topic. Regarding of Matthew twenty eight. Nineteen OK. I do have. Another question and I don't know if but I'm going to share this with you in this moment. Let's go to. Two or shown three sixteen. John three sixteen yes. Is a concept of Bigart him. There are some people use in. This takes. I'm asking about the meaning of what does it mean. To be gotten Son of God you know. There are press. Sin in. Doubt today in the morning I share what Catholicism is teach in regarding regarding these dystopic. And Catholicism I mention that they believe that there is spirit proceeds from the song under father and the song proceeds from the father saw that is that is in essence the conceptual framework of Catholicism regarding the Trinity and. This sign for catalysis is in the book by the way in the in the rear of the book you are going to find out that. It says that this song was begotten did they self attorney thirty. And the Holy Spirit or the spirit was came for on their father under song that is the the framework of of cattle he seems to my taste so my view my perception is that is very close to the issue hope of witnesses fish and by the way very close in certain sense this is this is I Am i never were. To be discussing with catalytic I was that. When every time that I read and I question the topic and I mention the Catholic some people began to read the catechism and say Well that is want to cut a case and say I saw a this is the first time and reason about this so listen listen go to. To the point here where is the concept of of be gotten and what is the meaning of that my perception and I'm going to to share with you. That is my personal view regarding this dystopic a nice be. If. It is it is related to songs too little two sons two and you are going we are going to read from verse one through seven. Psalms two. Bursts one through seven. I'm reading from clinch a version. Electronic version you have here where do the healing race and the people you mention of a thing the kings of the years said then serves and the rulers take counsel together against the Lord and who gains he's anointed saying let's break their bands assumed or and cast away their cords from ass he that seated in the heavens shall law of the lower shall have them in the Rhaetian then shall he is pick only to them in his rust and vex them in his sword displeasure yet I set my keen upon my holy heel of science I will declare to the Cree which here the Lord say capital letters of sorrow that. The Lord had say unto me that art my son this day I have begun to empty. This day I have gotten to. Saw by the way. There are several. Cases So there are lemons to hear one one say so annoyed that. The beginning. It is. The least that ward Miss Sayah. Or Mrs Indonesia. And their translation into the Septuagint. Toss that is the anointed. OK And the verse seven when say and I will declare the creed the Lord that say unto me that you are my son this day I have been gotten He is a moment of. Setting a Kenyan or putting a team and he's thrown in through an imminent moment of that that is very important moment in description here in the Psalms. And when. When we when we are comparing this it is quite interesting that there is a kind of symbolic use of be gotten. Why because you cannot you cannot be a child are keen on being be gotten into same day all together. You understand what I'm saying that is that is my understanding and that is a symbolic use here for Daintree an amount of of a keen. On each call in. My son and also say because N.T.. Yes. No I mean. Not. That way I think they got many. Wrong. Why not. Question. Do you know any one after the other and that was born in the same way of Holland. I don't know. But I think. I know that. You. And Miss You know. The context first the context is not the same situation it's not the same but Cavaleri it's not the same force of the creation of father you can call creation making a father. Is not the same thing so here is very clearly a symbolic use in the Bible regarding regarding that and when you go to the context in which is that he used. What is what is the meaning here off of the garden. For me is that he is and troll on induct kind of position from that moment on and that kinship is God given King King done to him. That he is that is the perception I do have regarding that So when say this day I began. He. The Lord. Is talking about that of somebody that is already born. With. Nothing now. Lies right. Why. Then maybe. You know like. That. Well you know we are. We what we need to do is to compare the Bible with the Bible isn't it and when we aren't THAT is what we are going to do because when you compare the Bible with the Bible you are going to see that this tax is going to be using the new testament of. Arnie's are going to be used in the moment of Jesus reaching heaven. After you know resurrection and you are going to find out that in the book of Fox's Dean. In the book of fever you Chapter one Verse five so what we need to do sometimes is when we have difficulties in the Bible we need to compare Bible with Bible but not discredit the Bible for itself because Bible is he even by inspiration of the Lord. And when sometimes we are saying well why so difficult. Why this way or what is this way what we need to we need to read the Bible and compare text with text. And that is that is the rationale of the chance meeting of of the Bible versions and or or the Bible for us. So but it is very clear for me that he cannot be born in the same day in which is our grown adult and King all together. At that moment when you say well is that the case no it's not so is figurative or symbolic language that we have here and we need to understand that for example let's go to the New Testament and and you are going to see how in the New Testament you are going to find out the supply. Hebrews Chapter one Verse five. Let's go to the book of Hebrews New Testament Chapter one Verse five. You have it could you read please. Were to me ever. So when when you think about this and you reflect it's not of angels that he is talking in Son second very clear here and this is the understanding coming from the New Testament. Because as you know saying this is noise this is not about angels. So this is about the divinity of Jesus this is about this is reaffirm and and the heavenly nature of the Lord Jesus here is very clear in the context and he's recognisance. In the New Testament about that so when when you go to look to text by tax the Bible is informing you about. You know that we need to rest will that. With the rest of the scriptures of the Bible yes. I mean I don't I mean I mean on the one that. It is and this is not I don't know and I think. I don't mean that. We're. Not. Saying you're. Not in that. Area. OK let's go to X. book of Acts Chapter thirteen versus thirty through thirty three. No thirteen one three. Chapter thirteen versus thirty two thirty three. So the Bible say so here. But the Garda have raised him from the day. And for many days he appeared to those who came up with him from Galilee to Gen select. The very ones who are now his witnesses to the people and we preach to you the good news of the promise. Made to the fathers that god. Will feel his promise to our were children in that he raise up she says US It is also written in the second son. My son today I be gotten you. So in this way we can see several things one is the relationship of prediction and fulfillment. Is clear from a prediction and fulfillment cycle Jesus continues coming from the line ash from the line of David Jesus is a night that. We call a ministry in favor of the heathen nations through the gospel message and he will research wrecked and ascend into heaven where he swore ship by angels of heavens and that is the connection with YRI of chapter one verse five and the concept of be gotten of Jesus is. Is very also clear regarding the connection with the Book of Psalms because Doug means they link with heaven. Salvation for the human beings. Yeah. That is my understanding. There are there are several times in the New Testament. Known this is. This is this is the north are related to that but you asked me what is my understanding regarding that OK. OK my understanding regarding that has to do with the A.P. still to the Philippians chapter two. Let me share with you in Amman. You haven't Philippians to. Chapter five on through eleven. Chapter two verse five three eleven. Lit this mind be in June which was also in Christ Jesus who being in the form of God though it not robbery to be equal with God. But Mazen serve of not reputed ition and took upon him the form of a servant and was made in the likeness of men and being found in fashion as a man he humble conserve sorry. He humble conserve and became obedient old to death even there is of the cross. Word for God also have how eagerly exiled him and give him a name which is a boy of every name dot the name of she says Every mean shield bow or of thinks in heaven and thinks in earth and things under the earth and that every Tom should confess that Jesus is crises the Lord to the glory of God the Father. That is the concept of the. Cannot empty in South that he says that he's here it is is very clear in this point so. He submit stuff. And it is very clear in the New Testament all division in the New Testament is that that kind of these and I do have regarding the person who of the Lord Jesus. Yes Book of John John John fourteen. Or. Yeah you are going to to find out some kind of the mission of the Lord Jesus because one in the divinity in the Unity level has to fulfill that mission to came to save the humankind and he accept that droll that function. And that is the function of the Lord Jesus. If you have any questions for to morrow please write it down like today one of you did it. And I will try to bring the answer to do that yes. Yes you can do it now or whatever it is is fine but to morrow in the morning I'm going to be dealing Why was there a section of the pioneers of the Trinity. We see today on how we evolved into time. With the position that we have today right. Here. OK you're right you're right so. It's OK they see you to morrow thank you for coming. You know. I do I do think that version in English. Is a very good version is my understanding OK I understand also that he's very old. And these the callant in the English you know is not appealing to the new generations what is what is your estimation Ingle regarding versions in English. And the new version. Yeah. The new what. Well. Listen are going to point out now we're going to perfect my answer regarding that there are some. There are certain versions with interpretation and we need to be very we need to be very careful in use in that. Because interpretation is going to use in certain sense diffuse of the translator. I've been translating work for seven. Years in South America. And TRANSLATOR You mean you are in the middle of a process you have the author that he's communicating M.S.S. and you have the audience and you have to be faithful with the author and you need to be clear with the audience. And we need to convey in this act miss in a different culture sometimes so you need to know what is. Good languish Doug you are going to see proper to convey what is in the original version in order that the person that is receiving. Be in December can I will say with your soul there are examples I can provide and I am very concerned sometimes because. Our societies and. On there are other versions so on our use in several authors with different backgrounds and sometimes this translators are with their own tradition and sometimes one one little ward is going to to make a change very big here here there are Spanish speaking people and no no no I am. I'm going to put up an example about this you remember the Bible when when say this. I mean I'm in I say to you to date you are going to be in part of the ice remember not OK. For some reason in this panic version they put a K. that is so a what a dot in the middle you know and I question that because it's not in the. Listen I not are not an expert but I am very clear that we need to be faithful to what the Bible say and when you change a little. Click war you know the never sought is going to affect the understanding and when the Bible say since Pan is the same thought that the eagle care or hysterectomies want to pray so that is what is Satan Spanish that that war is not in duration so what do we need to do is to be to convey the word in a sack meanin in order that indeed all the anguish this case English has to be reprieved cation of the Isaak meaning in the order in this case in Greek so in this it is important. So I will say together with England that know the chambers and they are a good. Twenty four look. Good ten twenty twenty three cents or twenty three verse forty seven. Fifty two See you tomorrow and less since. 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