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Tough Questions About the Godhead- Part 4

Cory Herthel Darryl Bentley




  • June 19, 2017
    11:00 AM
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Our loving father his are privileged to come before the throne of grace the Sefton. And Lord we recognize that without you we have no understanding it will only be human wisdom and Lord when we're talking about scriptural things we won't more than human wisdom yes we want godly wisdom and so Father please just come and be with us we pray about the power of the Holy Spirit the Lord I pray that you would use pastor Korean myself as simply your mouth pieces Lord we have nothing to offer except what you share with us that we might share with others and so Lord today I pray for your people that are listening that are watching that they might receive the meat in due season that they need as it relates to these critical topics these critical subjects tough questions about the Godhead So thank you Lord for being with us thank you so much for your love and for your guidance for we ask these things in Jesus name Amen amen Patrick or before we jump in I want to review just 1 component of what we've covered in the past and on day 1 as we thought about putting this seminar together and we prayed about it we both felt impressed that the place to start was with the authority of the Scriptures and I just want to reiterate that as we get started today we are willing to be dependent upon the Word of God to find and discover God's doctrines God's teachings and so we spent that 1st day laying that foundation seen once again that you can trust the word of God that it is something reliable but then we also talked about a subject that has been kind of a buzz word within the admin to church in the last few years it's this idea of hermeneutics and if you would just just briefly what were some of the aspects of hermeneutics that we covered in that day 1 because and the reason I want to do that today again is because as we study this we need to follow that same biblical hermeneutic that we discovered on day 1 that's right well just briefly what I'd like to say based on what you've said already is the fact that in order for us to build something we have to have. Solid and it's stable foundation and so without a stable foundation we can we can bring in materials from anywhere we want it wasn't too long ago you had a discussion and we're not going to mention names or area or anything but you had a discussion with a minister of another denomination who was challenging you about your particular positions on things because you were studying with somebody and the minister said to you that he didn't like the fact that you were indoctrinating a person and that you were doing all these things and teaching them and you said on doing a study in the Bible and that minister made a comment to you that was very shocking to me the minister said to you passed your up I remember correctly that's the problem with you is you're so narrow minded that you take everything just from the Bible in other words we should be able to build our faith on the Bible somewhat but then we should use other things like philosophies and ideas and pieces statements and so forth from mankind but the Bible tells us not to be cheated by philosophies and emptied to see with all that verse just yesterday yeah that's that's Paul there in kolache and he's saying it's not about philosophy they're in collage in chapter 2 but we need to focus on Christ that crisis of the essence and Jesus is the 1 that was notated in the scriptures as being the Word and the word that became flesh and dwelt among us so for us Pastor Darryl and for me I can't speak for anyone else but I could say for the administration because that's why I'm an admin This past and many years and that is that we hold this scripture in supreme authority it is the 1 that has the final say because it's the Word of God and it represents the will and characteristics of God So to answer your question about the biblical hermeneutic if you look in your Bibles in Isaiah Chapter 28 in verse 10 we find they are in scripture so we didn't come up with this hermeneutic that's 1 thing I want to make sure that people understand it's not a it's not a Darryl and Corey thing and it's not an Adventist term and it's wrong it's a bible hermeneutic them liable gives us the key and tells us how we ought to study it in order to arrive at a proper theology or understanding of God And so this hermeneutic tells us that we should stop. The Bible line upon line precept upon precept here a little and there a little so we need to take the Scriptures a whole precept upon precept is just idea upon idea allow the ideas to flow remember that is God revealed His will to mankind and as things were expressed they were expressed from a human perspective and so their ideas that come together and this hermeneutic leads us then to understand that there are certain contexts which must be considered you have a historical context remembering that things as Pastor Darrell loves to say didn't happen in a vacuum and history was taking place the world was spinning on its axis it was rotating around the sun and things were happening in the world you have a literary context we have to remember that each verse in the Bible is not its own work it's a part of a greater work it's part of a passage the passage is part of a chapter the chapter is part of a book and the book is part of the whole of scripture so we want to consider the Bible as a literary work and then finally we want to understand and consider the way God spoke to the people his principles are timeless they are eternal they don't change the Bible tells us in Malakai 3 that the Lord is the same he doesn't change change and Hebrews 138 we're reminded of that again when it says Jesus Christ is the same yesterday for today and forever and so this hermeneutic of understanding how God spoke to people this cultural context is not the Bible twists and fits cultures but it's how it's related those timeless principles how they're related to the people and why certain language might have been used so as for certain example certain examples illustrations certain a list ration is for sure and so as we go through the Word of God we want to understand those 3 fold context and then apply that same biblical hermeneutic that the Bible gives us in order to come to our conclusions and to understand what God's will is for us in each topic we study thank you so much for sharing and I appreciate that bridge that brief review there is 1 thing that we haven't pointed out directly we. Kind of set it 10 Gentilly maybe you would say it's going more implicit sure instead of exploits it but basically also what we're saying and this is another thing I love about the I've been a church is we don't take just the New Testament you know because how many times have you run into a Christian this says oh I'm a New Testament Christian and basically what they're telling you is that they embrace dispensational as theology right and they'll say all the Old Testament was written for a disparate different dispensation and it's been fulfilled but now we're in the Christian dispensation and so I don't need the Old Testament the problem is if you say you don't need the Old Testament you have no foundation for Jesus the ology Yeah because when Jesus he was only quoting the old time that's right it when he would say for it is written man should not live by bread alone he got that from Deuteronomy and so we have to remember that exactly and when you read the New Testament pastoral how much of the New Testament is simply a repeat of the Old Testament where the percentage is really high I mean in special you look through Revelation John is struggling to try to figure out how to express these beautiful things these fantastic in the maybe even terrifying things that he's seen so he Baris borrows very heavily from the Old Testament for these passages to describe things but let's keep moving I just wanted to stick give a little review because as we think about who is the eternal Son we recognize Jesus is the 1 but we want to see that as we build from scripture that we're following God's method of Bible study and so we're going to jump in with our 1st so called tough question and this one's not really that tough at all but what do the Scriptures have to say about the sun Do they have much to say about Jesus lolo's find out I love this place to start here we are in John chapter 1 verses 1 through 3 and we read here in the beginning was the word in the Word was WITH God and the word want was God The Word was God hold on to that little piece we're going to come back to that we're going to explore that more but in verse 2 it goes on to say he was in the beginning with God. And here's an interesting point all things were made through Him and without him nothing was made that was named so in other words anything created and I'm just breaking this down based on what John is willing to look in his bones already brought anything at all anything that was created if it has a beginning then Jesus is the 1 that created. I mean is that not what the Scripture says if we're going with Remember we're going to follow that admonition from manuscript release Volume 30 and it said take the Scriptures as they read OK so we don't have to parse that down we don't have to spiritualize it we don't have to go off and meditate and wonder what's it saying it's saying he made it all he made everything you see if it's here if it exists Jesus is the 1 and that would be I mean nothing was made that was made if it were not for him so that means anything of this world any other planet out there any other galaxy out there every star if it was me if it had a beginning if it was created it came from the hands of Jesus and that's an amazing thought because how many people miss that beautiful fact that Jesus is not only the 1 who recreates us right here rescues us from sin but he's the 1 that created us in the 1st place and when you think about when when God knelt down and formed Adam out of the dust of the earth it was Jesus love him hands who did that for me who did that shaping who just put everything exactly where it was supposed to be it was Jesus who performed the 1st surgery that's right so to speak and took the air to man I love that part since we're just talking about that just for a 2nd to contemplate that that creation account of mankind not only did he shape him with the hands but he intimately brought life to him because it says then God If you read there in Genesis then God breathed into his nostrils and he became a living soul Jesus put bread in an intimate way in the end there's a nice contrast that you're bringing out there everything else was spoken let there be this let there be that but it when it came to that which was created in the likeness in the image of God There was a very personal touch I love that was applied and let's not another verse of this over some points that I want to make that we're going to make together but let's add another verse to this continuing in the same passage of Scripture just a little farther down in verse 14 what do we find there and the word. Became flesh and dwelt among us and we beheld His glory so now we're seeing the word is being referred to as he and his the glory as of the only big of the Father full of grace and truth OK So we have this this beautiful picture that's painted in verse 1 of the gospel according to John verse 1 chapter 1 it begins to use this image of the word in the beginning was the word in the Word was WITH God in the Word was God there's a few things that we can draw from this and basically I would suggest and I think you would agree with me it indicates the timelessness of Christ as God and man and so if if if if he is connected in that way to the everlasting God there are some conclusions that 1 can draw from that because of the inherent nature of who God is a man does that sound fair I agree with you well if Jesus had a beginning the in the sense of being created or be gotten then he could not qualify as being so there's that word be gotten that sometimes be able to deal with it OK we're going to deal with that we're not going to gloss over it because some people say well you don't want to deal with tough passages Well the title of the seminar is tough questions so we're not going to avoid this idea of being The gotten because the Bible is very clear about it and I'm actually very excited today to share with those that are watching that are listening what we've discovered about this idea of the IN THE gotten so because he was God as the word Jesus must be given equality with the father well and I because I love how it's the same exact Yeah because in John chapter 1 and in those 1st few verses very 1st verse it says in the beginning was the word by itself the word the word was with God So there you have company you have a group and the Word was God So here by itself together and now equally you kind of see how that right there is and there's a little part that we should emphasize there it's. A little nuance that some people may gloss over says the Word was God it didn't say the word became got a man and because it says the Word was God and that is the direct indication always has been really existed that's right it always ends it at this point of beginning the beginning of what we see here as our earth as you know the history of this planet when Jesus came to the scene to perpetrate and you know that creation you know exercise his creative power he already was got a man he didn't become God that's right and so there's a timelessness there of Christ that John is attributing to him remember 2nd Timothy 316 tells us that how much of the scripture is given by inspiration all also either all of it so we know this is in God's inspired word noticed this being the creator is another timeless quality of God that is here attributed to Jesus and we know from Genesis No You know I love that he burst Yes you do so this is this is fascinating for me we know from Genesis that God created and here's a little Latin phrase for you we've been telling Greek and Hebrew thought it was time for some Latin Rite X. in the Hilo this phrase X and hello as you can see from the parentheses there simply is a Latin phrase that means out of nothing and because it's we know this because of the word Bharat Now what is Bharat this is a word that is only ever used with got when a man creates something the Hebrew word Bharat is never used with man it is only with God and you know God did not run off to the galactic Home Depot he didn't say I need a planet building kit right right he created out of nothing and so there is this beautiful quality in there that can only be attributed to he who is divine in man that which is divine in again we see the language itself giving us these little insights and you don't see Berat come out in the English All we see is in the beginning God created the heavens and the earth right that's. Right but we see here when you look at it that language has a way to minute that word created is barrage and then when you do a word study you see that barrage is never conjugated it is never put together with the human creation and so it's just a quality of God in this timelessness of Don and I don't know about you but that just I just love how God pulls those kind of things together well and I believe that he does that because he wants us to see that he wants us to see those those details and understand that when it comes to dealing with God He said grid there's something different about him and that's what you know when you and we can go off on a tangent I promise not to do that but when we think about when we worship God when we approach God when we pray when we sing to God how we dress when we come to church on Sabbath all of these different things that we do there's a reason for it because we don't want to mingle all the common things of life and of this world with the sacredness of God and His existence we want to have those things separate and so you know sometimes folks will wonder why you know like why the why do we dress up so nice for church on Sabbath What are we doing we're not doing it for 1 another we're doing it for God but there shouldn't be we shouldn't be doing it for 1 now that's right we want to be doing that we want to give our best to the Lord representing ourselves before God and we want to represent him and so when you think about that that we're Berar it's a word that's been set aside for that sacred purpose it's like a it's a it's a sacred tool that God has to be able to Laura and I just think that's pretty awesome that we can see as you say those details in the original languages a man well let's deal with this idea that came out in John 1 verse 14 there you know the word came in because scuse me the word became flesh and dwelt among us and then it mentions this being the only begotten of the Father and so it begs the question does this phrase Nein Jesus has a beginning because that's a question that is circling around and it's not. Only a question that circles outside of Adventism but there are people within the administration which that are actually promoting and openly promoting saying that. And had this type of beginning some eons ago so we need to ask the question is that what is being said here as it relates to only begun well you know what I think we ought to do go to the word Let's ask the Bible you know I'm because Pastor Darrell I can guarantee you that anybody that is here in the audience today and anybody who's maybe watching this on live stream or may watch it again or listen to it no matter if they like us or don't like this our opinion doesn't matter that much what matters is can we show from the Bible why we hold the position we hold and hopefully by the grace of God Help people to come to a conclusion on their own as the Holy Spirit leads them through the word to conclude the correct conclusion absolutely Well I do believe the Bible has the answer for us and soliciting in last dive into the language we're going to share a little more for with you from the languages this phrase that's been translated here is only be gotten actually comes from the Greek word money geneticists and so monitor and they says mano instantly we know what Mama means right 1 manone means 1 or singular but then it begs the question What's the genesis part there right this word is actually poorly translated believe it or not in most biblical translations because when when this word in how it's been used through antiquity is actual you know you do the research on it it actually doesn't just mean only be gotten now the only you've got them on the park there right but what we see is that the best Greek translations are actually this that mana Jeanette's is actually means unique. Or want to know though I would have to say to you that there has probably never been someone as unique as Jesus and never will be never will be a man because if Jesus could be replicated or duplicated how can he thereby be my savior that's right and there's some for there is something we're going to touch on here in just a moment that I think you put everybody will really appreciate that helps us understand why the Jesus was so unique but this idea of getting hung up on somehow that Christ was big gotten in the sense of having in the original beginning it's just simply not substantiated in the Bible and in the original languages Well the problem is again when we translate the Bible from the original languages into English you mention that the other day it's even with with modern languages today from Spanish to English or from French to English or English back to Spanish it's hard sometimes to directly translate word for word and be able to carry the thought out as it's intended Well it's even hard with a word let's just use the name Jesus if you take the name Jesus and go back to what it would have been in the Hebrew it was just you know it's right most people don't go around saying you know I now pray and yes she was named some people do but I'm not going there today but look how did we get from you shua to Jesus it's a transliteration That's right no transliteration is where you take the letters from or of a word or a name from 1 language and you try to letter for letter reproduce that name in another language and so when you take issue and try to take it into Greek Now all of the letters don't naturally match up so you issue actually becomes. Now it's starting to sound a little more familiar to us right and so then you take this and you bring it through other languages German being 1 of the predecessors in the 1 of the languages that we look at with the logical works but now into English gets transliterated into Jesus and so we see that some of these things we need to dig back into the original language to figure it out but it does beg the question. If Jesus is simply this unique 1 he's the 1 and only there is no other way let us know what nobody else like him in what way was the son begun so let's try to answer that question from the scriptures if you would All right Luke chapter 1 of verse 35 says and the angel answered and said to her so this is just to bring this into context obviously this is the history of Jesus being conceived and this is the angel speaking to Mary so Mary's getting information that something's radical about to happen in her life that's right you know the Holy Spirit will come upon you and the power of the highest will overshadow you therefore also that Holy 1 who is to be born will be called the Son of God Now what's interesting pastoral just as I look at this Mary had to have some information as she hears this information she had to know something already having been taught something so when it says that Holy 1 who is to be born will be called the Son of God That's the Holy 1 who is to be born is indicative that this information she should know already absolutely and obviously where she didn't know it from because she knew her Scriptures a Miss Right because she was a woman who feared God in further down in Luke we find that she was a blessed woman among women she had she had a godliness about her she was close and had a relationship now she was not a god woman I'm not saying that nor has she become a guy and she's not become a god woman she was absolutely 100 percent human just as you and I are human but she had a relationship to God that God saw and said this is going to be the unit this is going to be the medium I was I'm going as a trust for the vessel she's a vets' ring forth the Son of God that is human form and so she knew in this angel says that Holy 1 who is to be born she's thinking I remember with the Prophet Isaiah said I know these prophecies I'm looking at the timeline and she realizes I can trust what I'm being told there's just imagine if somebody I've had people ask that question you know how did Mary know that and. And what how would I respond if if an angel or an angelic type being appeared to me and told me something like this how would I know that they weren't telling me a lie the reason why again she wasn't basing it off of how she felt she wasn't basing it off of emotion she knew her scriptures Well this wasn't this wasn't anything shocking because how long how many generations they have been begging for the Messiah looking for the Messiah but they knew the timeline and that's what's so important and key about the Bible is to that's why we as Adventists take such a strong stance on prophecy is because in order to know whether or not we're being deceived we've got to know the truth and we've got to be able to understand those prophecies and when they're supposed to happen because I tell you what the Bible tells us that devils demons fallen angels can appear as angels of light to us and they can tell us messages that sound great and wonderful and they have the ability to work miracles they did in miracles and so the thing is if they can do that and we don't know our scriptures well enough like Mary knew it when that angel came and said that Holy 1 Whose do you mourn the time has come the prophecy is being fulfilled that prophecy there in Daniel Chapter 9 is being fulfilled right now as she has a chapter 9 but she knew it was being fulfilled and she knew that she could trust what she was being told it's so important that we know our scriptures and I'm in no question about it so let's let's draw some conclusions then those who are were taking that precept upon precept to line upon line here a little there a little so far we've looked at John we've looked at these various passages now we're coming here to Luke let's start putting some of these things together based on what the scriptures have revealed to us Jesus is be gotten only in the sense that he took on humanity. I have no problem saying to people you're absolutely right Jesus was big on but we've got to qualify it by Scripture and that's we have to qualify it by Scripture because here's the thing I can not say 2 things you know speak out of both sides of my mouth you know the old saying absolutely I cannot stay out of 1 side of my mouth that Jesus was the Word and the Word was God meaning that he will was God before he came to do his creative well and anything that was created anything that was made without him would not have been made that's right I can't say that out of 1 side of my mouth and say that he has that wonderfully divine power to create worlds to create beings and then out of the other side of my mouth say that he had a beginning the 2 are in can grew it and then not only that we have Scripture telling us I mean we just looked at the verse the Holy Spirit will overshadow you in the power of the most scuse me the Holy Spirit will come upon you in the power of the most high will overshadow you we have scriptural evidence telling us very clearly how Jesus was be gotten and when he was begun in men and when we follow that prophetic timeline Well all we have to do is look like you said and in chapter 9 we knew how many years it would be until Messiah the Prince and then you can calculate about words from there Gabriel by the way was real and that's right Gabriel gives Daniel the starting point and then he gives him the math so he's exactly right so the only thing that we can say about Jesus being be gotten absolutely what he was begun but only to take on human form so become the Messiah be gotten doesn't necessarily have to mean created That's right absolutely I would also say this because of the scriptural evidence again this is not just my opinion this is what we have already seen from the scripture just in these few moments today Jesus is not be gotten in the sense that he has a beginning point way back in time ago we do not see that John 11 could not. Be accurate and assert that the Word was God If Jesus has a beginning and we've already said this but I want to reiterate it for folks today to assert that Jesus has a beginning when the Bible clearly says he is gone is to nullify that Jesus is God at all sure because again it goes back to God is the only 1 that can do Bara that creative work out that not that creative work and so again I I hang on to that scripture there in John chapter 1 and the 1st 3 verses when you can read the whole chapter and it just gives you this nice build and lead up to how he is the Messiah and all these things but you cannot have that where he is the 1 that all things were created and there's other text that I'd like us to brief on if we get time but there are other Texas say that all things were created and subsist because of him so because of Jesus he is what holds the galaxies in order basically So if he didn't exist at 1 point who was doing that and I mean it begs the question and I would feel lastly say on this point God cannot be God and have a beginning around he ceases to qualify we've already kind of said that but I just wanted to restate it as a simply as possible because because if if if if I have a God that I have created then that God is lesser than me. And so if Jesus has a time when he had a beginning some time eons ago where he was be gotten that makes him less of God. If it got it all well and think about this pastor Darrell what about the engines in heaven maybe if we're saying if Jesus had this this beginning at some point in antiquity that some people try to say that he had our There ain't jewels then that were in existence these supernatural beings these messengers of God Were they in existence prior to that and then would that not put Christ in a lower position than them absolutely makes a lot of sense well let's let's turn to another tough question then does the Bible testify to Jesus' eternal quality and nature do we find evidence you know we've already looked at John 1 morning my mind that was plenty of evidence but again it goes back to that statement for some people no amount of evidence will ever be enough but the Bible does give us plenty upon which we can hang our faith so we're going to explore just a little bit further and I love this text pastor Daryl's 1 of my favorite past it really is I've written more than 1 sermon on it but this is Jesus speaking to the fair sees the church leaders in his day remember the Bible told us in John chapter 1 that the word came in it well to mung this and and he came to dwell among his own and his own knew him not well what's what's interesting to me is the people who were the religious leaders I mean it would have been the equivalent of the over Mark Finley's the elder Doug bachelors that should have been the hair and you know those are the heralds of the gospels you know Pastor John Bradshaw that you know that's coming here or can't meeting starting last night Stephen Moore that's been here over the past weekend these guys are heralding the 2nd coming of Christ what the fairest sees in Jesus they should have been doing the same thing about the Messiah That's right when he came the 1st time and yet when he came they they rejected him because it wasn't what they personally were wanting they were reading into the Scriptures what they wanted to have and when Christ came they didn't know him so here Jesus is is presenting to them these are Jesus' words here in John Chapter 8 and we're going to begin in verse 56 Jesus is speaking to the fairies he is who thought they were really something because they were Abraham's descendants and they could they could trace their genealogy all the way back to Abraham these these guys were serious about their scriptures and so he says them your father Abraham rejoiced to see my day. And he saw it was glad the Jew said to him You're not even 50 years old yet and you have seen Abraham Jesus said to them most assuredly I say to you now when that translation that most assuredly Jesus is saying You better believe it right here I mean this is the most direct statement Jesus can and if I'm not mistaken the King James says verily verily very truth will injure him very very is that Verity Vera Taso That's right and so truthfully truthfully In other words as emphatically as I can tell you this is truth amen he says I say to you before Abraham was I am and every time I have lived there so does not give you those who will do spawn feel and I love that because in this moment what we can see is that Jesus is telling the Farriss they knew their scriptures Well now they didn't apply them well they didn't they didn't exegetical e approach the scriptures they didn't use a proper hermeneutic because they arrived at the wrong conclusion Amen and here was their lord their Messiah standing before them and their spitting on him and rejecting him and going to nail him to a cross eventually Jesus saying before Abraham was I am when they heard Jesus make this statement be I am statement on their minds immediately went back to Exodus their minds immediately went back to Mt horror and they are imagining Moses standing there and that burning bush which they would have called it an eye they are imagining Jesus just stole a title well they knew exactly what he was saying that they would have to go get somebody and say what does that mean that I am know they knew that Jesus was declaring he was the divine self exams we don't have the rest of the passage up on the screen but if you look in your Bibles for angels see they responded violently What was their reaction they picked up stones they were going to stone him right there in the temple. Own they were going to stone him and here's why this phrase as you just said takes our minds back to Exodus 3 in verse 14 God tells Moses that He is the I Am Who I Am and it is the imam who is calling out the people and it's right we know the situation right God's people are in this oppressive you know slave state under the Egyptians God says it's time for my people to be freed in Moses had 40 years of character development in the sheep so now he's chosen Moses to go and be the 1 through whom he would bring the liver and for his people Moses bites him or I or who do I even tell them sent me tell them the I AM has sent them well most of us would have known what the I am meant that's right we don't fully get it I don't think it just says well who are you I am I know you is because I see you yet in English it does not have the weight that it has does it have that punch right straight I know you is but here's what it's actually saying in the Bible the Hebrew phrase that is being translated here is how you. Are and got it in the Hebrew in case that it was your fancy the word how you are literally means to be or to exist so let's start piecing this together so I am who I am literally means that I exist because I exist or another way that you could say it and still be true to the text as I am the self exists and there's nothing that began God That's incredible is and it's incredible and especially to a finite mind yet it's really uncomfortable as not only as humans do we get a birth certificate when we breathe our last of last breath and we also get a death certificate certificate for for if so for us we have a definitive beginning we have a definitive in timeline right we have a timeline. God doesn't have that he's saying listen go and get my people and tell them that the self-existent 1 is calling them I know it it's just incredible just blows your mind I think of a quote that I once read about John Wesley the reformer. Started up the Methodist Church John Wesley said if you can find for me a word that can explain and describe a man to you then I'll show you a man that can fully explain and describe the nature and care of God something to that of yeah I love that quote and I love I love that statement because it just is saying that God is so remarkable he's so outstanding he so amazing he's such an awesome being that for us to think that we can narrow him down and break everything down and understand every detail about who he is we can't do that and we're going to spend eternity studying that topic and saluting and but I love how this just comes to life and how this has such a deep meaning for us to say I am the self-existent 1 well I just love this because I was this is like I exist because I was this and it kind of harkens back you remember when job is going through his his pity parties and listlessly faired a job right he went through some stuff was pretty run he's complaining he's doing through his thing right and got asked the question scuse me where were you when I created everything and what were you doing can you remind me what you were doing. And God almost seems to be coming off a little a little smart to him but basically he's saying I'm the only 1 who has been here from time eternal and so Jesus when He says that he is the same self existant god who spoke from the burning bush to Moses he's making that declaration that listen you don't have to wonder about who I am I have always been here I will always be here and that takes us to our next thought that if we are Christians and we say we believe in Jesus with all our hearts when Jesus made. That declaration I am who I am he says I am he's using this title there's only 1 of 2 conclusions we can come to either Jesus is the self existing God in flesh at that point either he is who he says he is or is a major imposter or he's a huge imposter and deserve to be crucified absolute I mean it's only 1 of the 2 and I'm going ask anyone listening or any any viewer and those that are in our audience which do you accept are you Christian do you believe Jesus was who he said he was or do we turn and say Jesus a lot I don't think so I don't think any 7 they have a description of this point is willing to say no matter where you are on this issue then he was going to say Jesus was alive well and it would be pointless to call yourself a Christian why because then we would meet in the same condition as the Jewish believers that's true we're still looking for a messiah That's right but we are firmly convinced that Jesus was the Messiah and now he stands as our King of Kings and Lord of lords and we have other places Jesus calls himself there in Johnny 58 he declares Before Abraham was I am and that itself existed when he's claiming divinity he's claiming eternal existence but there's other places in the Bible pastoral where he basically makes the same statement in other words 1 of the absolute of Laura's Absolutely and 1 of our favorite books to discuss to teach from is the Book of Revelation I just find so many Jim so much value and we know why it's valuable because the very 1st verse says it's a revelation of Jesus Christ and anything revealing to us about Jesus is great is awesome That's exactly right so let's look at verse 8 here Jesus makes the declaration I am the Alpha and the Omega the Beginning in the end says the Lord who is and who was and who is to come the Almighty to say that you're the alpha and the Omega 1st and last letters of the Greek alphabet write what it what is kind of quoting there he's saying listen I'm everything I'm the beginning I'm the end I'm everything in between. Everything there has been and everything that will be amazing I am the 1 who is I am here now I'm the 1 who was does that match up with John chapter 1 verse 1 yes it does in the beginning what was the word in the Word was WITH God in the Word was God noticed friends line upon line precept upon precept you're a little there a little it all matches up in ties together with Scripture and it would stand to reason here that the language of how this is described to us because remember the Bible was written 3 human into Jesus the Holy Spirit lead in this things revealed and so John who wrote the gospel and 1st John 2nd John 3rd John he also wrote Revelation so the language is going to sound the same and I love that we can take those writings and compare them and then see that from his perspective he's telling us basically the same thing as it's being revealed but I really love that who is well that this is Jesus in this in the condition of being in glory again he's back in heaven and he's actually being presented here to a high priest's lemo he's in the High Priest mode and he's saying who is in that condition right now who was in that condition that he's in right now and who is to come in that war fighting mission is when Jesus comes this next time the 1st time he came as a lamb to be slain the next time he comes as a king and all of his glory and absolutely I love have the last little phrase there the Almighty and should I should it's just a powerful powerful powerful taxed. Well if Jesus is God and at this point I'm thoroughly convinced that others are as well it begs the question is he worthy to receive worship if he's God and Adelaide he just you know we're here in Michigan conference we really believe in evangelism in the last unlock revelation series that we did spring of last year had a lady that wanted to meet with me afterwards and 1 of her big questions she was actually upset with me and she wanted to straightening out and she wanted me to understand that Jesus was not supposed to be worshiped and I've heard this before you know and so I just simply in a did what I often do would you please just show me that from the Word of God. I'm not in arrested in arguing with people I'm not in arrest and debating with people I simply want to ask the question show me from the Word of God you're a man and so after she showed me I had to ask her a few questions as a woman I show you a few texts and you tell me if they make sense to you Well here's 1 of the text that we looked at together would you be so kind as to read for seizure this is in Hebrews chapter 1 and I believe that Paul was the author of this we don't have anything definitive but just looking at the literary style and how it seems to match up he's the most likely author and it has that Pauline feel to it when he Reuss Chapter 1 Verse 6 and these but when he again brings the firstborn of the world on this he we discussed to see the bigger our Q. and A time so if you were here the other day we were talking about the Trinity and a lady asked a question with regard to Jesus and His nature and so forth and I took her to this this chapter he reached chapter 1 so when he this is talking about God the Father when he again brings the 1st morning to the world the firstborn would be Jesus he says let all the angels of God worship Him God the Father is telling the angels to do what folks to worship Jesus but to the son he says and he's in this is God the Father speaking to God the Son This is just blows my mind I love this he looks at me says in your throne Ogaden is for ever and ever it doesn't say from this time to this time he says it wasn't safe from whence you were being gotten eons ago right it says don't say that for ever and ever a scepter of righteousness is the scepter of your kingdom pastoralists is 1 of my favorite chapters in all of the New Testament because it declares to me beyond the shadow of a doubt the definitive the divinity the nature and the fullness of God that Jesus and notice this you know here's 1 of the points that we've been trying to make in this passage to me just puts the last now. Well in the coffin for it 1 of the points we've been trying to make is that force persons to come together and we've said that there's 3 persons of the Godhead because we see that in Scripture the Father the Son the Holy Spirit and what we've said is in order for those 3 persons to come together and qualify as being God they must be equally God on their own right you can't have 1 God and then a half god come together and then a 3 quarter God or a quarter God you can have these pies That's right these parts that come together persona speak these persons must individually and completely be God themselves in order to come together and form the 1 God that we worship in man and so here we have direct testimony from the scripture here we see but to the son he says your throne Oh God The good thing is I don't find anybody trying to deny that there is God the Father no praise the Lord that heresy hasn't risen yet Amen maybe there's time for it yeah I'm sure but here we have the undisputed. God of the universe the father declaring that Jesus also is fully God and how else could he address him has not only done not only that he's God but that he shares the throne he says your throne Oga not he doesn't even say our thrones is your throne It's as if he is deferring to the son that's pretty incredible it really is and so let's let's see if we find this theme of worship being followed 3 well are there other places in the Bible where others like maybe messengers were getting ready to receive worship and they stopped it immediately because they're saying worship only belongs to that which is divine and eternal not divine. Revelation 1000 in verse 10 at Venice the should be very familiar passage right we usually look to this for a different reason we're usually looking for the testimony of Jesus what does that mean well and I just loads going on here just real quickly you know John has been seeing in this vision number revelation as 1 vision folks it's 22 chapters but it's 1 vision that he's having here on the Isle of Patmos out in this exiled territory and he's been saying awful things taking place right he's missing these beasts rise up in the dragon chasing after people and and he's just seeing what's going to take place in the future and there's some really chaotic colossal things that are going to take place and so John is pretty upset then he comes to the wedding feast the wedding supper the Lamb What an awesome sight that must have been to be hold after all this chaos and turmoil to see how things are going to start to wrap up and to come to a conclusion and so John get so overwhelmed and he's so excited and then he says what does he say here he says and I fell at his feet now the his Here is referencing to the angel that's revealing the messenger as it's been bringing the vision right I fell at his feet to worship him but he said to me See that you do not do that why because I am your fellow servant and of your brother and who have the testimony of Jesus and he says don't worship me worship worship God. So we see here that this revelation of Jesus Jesus is being revealed how the world is going to respond to Jesus whether they're going to be loyal to him or to this beast power all of this is contrast in whether 1 to worship Jesus or worship the beast and receive his mark and so we know that this reference to worship God must be a reference to Jesus Christ in Revelation because that's who's been revealed throughout the totality of this vision then there's something else I think that we could tie into and I don't have this for the screen but I want to just throw this in let's go back to Exodus 3 when Moses approached the burning bush he was given some instruction What was he instructed to reduce and spews may have been instructed to do as it relates to his foot where he had to remove the sandals from his feet because just the presence of God made the surrounding area holy OK So we see there that's what we would refer to in scholarly circles as a in the parents the Often the is an appearance of God OK So we see there he took off his sandals Let's fast forward to Joshua chapter 5 and Joshua chapter 5 we see something very similar right there surrounding Jericho there waiting for the command to just follow through they know they're there to clean the cleanse the land and Joshua's sees somebody standing over there is this commander he sees this this being standin there right in a battle garb Joshua Moses' over to him and says Hey whose side are you on. And I love the response there we find in Joshua chapter 5 he says. I am the commander of the Lord's army and by the way you need to take off your shoes because you're standing on holy ground and so this we see in Joshua chapter 5 is actually Jesus in his pre-incarnate form a man as the commander as Michael as the commander of God's arms and credible and so he receives worship at the burning bush because we know he's the imam That's right he receives worship in Joshua chapter 5 and then we see in Hebrews chapter 1 and it's not the names will start to worship and he's not even just receiving worship in Joshua chapter 5 or at the burning question in Exodus 3 but he's telling these individuals this is what you need to do you need to be reverent now because you're before the presence of God Almighty in the angel certainly understood that don't bow down and worship me that's right there's only 1 that you should worship and worship God said to me these things are just so powerful and notice what we've done all we're trying to do is be faithful to Isaiah 28 in verse him that precept upon precept line upon line here a little there a little and when we do that God's word speaks to us in such a beautiful calm will it just illuminates it just comes in just jumps off of the pages so this really does Well we're getting short on time so let's look a little further and as we wrap up today and I like this question 1 who is the giver of eternal life now we've already discussed that Jesus is this creator right we read that in John chapter 1 but what about the giver of eternal life I wonder I wonder if there is any role that Jesus plays in that I think we know the answer already we don't only what I love this story in John Chapter 11 this is the story of Jesus very close friend last ris having gotten sick and died and the disciples heard about it Jesus heard about it and Jesus tells us I was there away from there and he tells us I suppose we've got to return because our friend Lazarus is asleep and I'm going to go and there's so many things going on. In that story we can learn so many principles about God's truth but not as in sermons that you have there are a nice as I want to go and I need to go wake him up and they say oh well if he's asleep we'll get better and so we know the story finally Jesus says he's dead and I'm glad that this happened for your sakes that you might believe so here we come in and Martha is just weeping and wailing because her brother died and I will say that she's upset at Jesus because she says Lord if you had been here this would have happened while she's definitely pointing the finger she and by the way and that she doesn't say it but I know she was thinking it probably by the way I sent word that's right did you get my text you didn't come on did you see my email and Jesus says 2 are here and 11 in verse 25 and 20 say I am the resurrection and the like he who believes in me though he may die he shall live in and whoever lives and believes in Me shall never die now there's 2 different types of death being spoken if you will is a physical death and then Revelation 20 I believe verse 5 tells us there's a 2nd is a 2nd death and that's that resurrection and to damnation that Jesus also boasts also spoke of in the Gospel of John that's right and so he says to her even though somebody might die or take their rest go to sleep if you will they shall live if they believe in me and whoever believes in you shall never truly die because they don't go to that condemnation that resurrection of damnation and then he asked survey question Do you believe this well I think she certainly did she did in and because we know that when Jesus 1st spoke to her she said he said to her Your brother will live again Oh I know we will at the last day that's right she reveals her understanding of biblical theology that's right she will Lord I get it he's going to be resurrected right I was kind of hoping to keep him a little longer that's right is basically what she's saying to him Well let's look at another passage Jesus is given that promise here he has that eternal life to all members and something I have eternal life he says I am the resurrection and the like so eternal life exists within him well in because it exists he does have it to give you men 1 could say what about. John 14 in verse 6 I always love this 1 goes of the 1st 3 verses are 1 of my favorite passages and then Jesus said to him Who is he speaking to remember oh Philip right Philip silent Lord yeah sure I was the fellow's a father we don't know the way of spreading right Jesus said to him I am the Way the Truth and the law if no 1 comes to the file there except through me so again you come back to that he's not saying I have it or I can get it for you to what I am give me a minute let me run of the store I am that life that's right and if you have money you have that life and you know 1st John Chapter 5 in verse 21 we find here Brother John says and we know that the Son of God has come and has given us an understanding that we may know Him Who is true and we are in Him Who is true in His Son Jesus Christ so in His Son God the Father Son Jesus Christ this is the true God and eternal life so again it's a very definitive statement and we're going to follow that counsel for manuscript release number 30 take the Scriptures as they read and I don't have to spiritualize that I don't have to find some fancy way to express it all I have to say is when I am in Jesus I have eternal life you know 1 of my it's very clear pastoral about being a 7th Day Adventists Christer a Christian and now a full time minister of the gospel is the fact that the way that we approach the viable this hermeneutic that we've been using this method of Bible study. There's a hymn that says I need no other evidence and some some hymnals as I need no other argument I need no other police it is enough that Jesus died and rose again for me the point is we can look in the Gospel we can look at the Bible we can take the Bible as it's given to us and we don't have to get red faced and huffy puffy and raise our voice we can just simply take the Bible as it reads and it reveals to us and expressively explicitly what the truth is about God and that's what led me to fall in love with this faith that we have that we share is because this church teaches and as ministers in the administers we teach and promote folks open up your Bibles study the Word of God It's right later before you let it let it speak to you and it does not have to be confusing let it speak to you and allow the Holy Spirit to lead you not Pastor we've we have so I think we could end right now and we wouldn't have to show anything else and I think that the point has been very well made from the Word of God However however the word has blessed our faith the Lord has blessed this in time movement of people with a special gift called the Spirit prophecy and in Saints and we are so grateful to have that particular gift which just and I'm not going to steal this from you explain your little your thing you know we look at that we look at the Bible we study the Bible and then as we conclude our Bible study we can go to these these tools that God's given us from the sperm the Spirit of Prophecy the special gift and as you mention it's like we've hammered it in How did you say it again well I've had the privilege of helping do a little bit of carpentry you know picked up a few little skills here in there and when you hang molding what you put molding around the door around a window you take those finishing nails and when you drive them in only so far in the little head is still sticking up and then you use a little punch Cottonelle set and you take that Nelse that you just drive that puppy in and when you do that nail is just clear below the surface and I think the by. I will has given us plenty today and we were able that we can take in we can nail down completely that Jesus is the eternal Son He is the the self existant Son of God And but we're going to we're going to take the mail now and we're going to set them now with this little nails with the nail set and I love this particular 1 I'll read this when he read the next closest sounds great from the signs of the Times August 29th 1900 Ellen White makes this statement and I think this is 1 of the most beautiful statements about Jesus Christ is the preexistent self-existent Son of God In speaking of his preexistence Christ carries the mind back through dateless ages there is no beginning he assures us that there never was a time when he was not in close fellowship with the eternal God he to whose voice the Jews within listening had been with God as 1 brought with him. It's done it's finished the nailed is set notice this 1 also signs of the times a profile of knights in $6.00 while God's word speaks of the humanity of Christ when upon this earth it also speaks decidedly I like that word regarding his preexistence the word existed as a Divine Being as the eternal Son of God in union and oneness with his father from everlasting he was the mediator of the covenant the 1 in Him all nations of the earth both Jews and Gentiles if they accepted him were to be blast the Word was WITH God and the Word was God before man or an angels were created the Word was WITH God and was gone I mean pastoral I don't know about you but as we come into this conclusion bringing this thing in for a landing as I have read these scriptures again and I have read every single 1 of these scriptures before today and before this study over and over again but as we put these together and as we've studied them line upon line and precept upon precept and now as we take the Spirit of Prophecy statements here at the end I mean pastor Darrell for me personally I don't know how I would ever come to another conclusion other than to say that we serve an awesome God and that Jesus Christ truly is what the scripture says he is he is the fullness of the Godhead bodily and he is the preexistent he is the I AM He is the 1 that stood there because you'll remember in those texts like at the burning bush there in Exodus 3 if we were to read that chapter it says the angel of the Lord called out to Moses and said Moses Moses the angel of the Lord anytime we read that the Old Testament that was Jesus in his pre-incarnate form. He demanded worship he demanded reverence there is no way to see it any other way other than Jesus is eternal He is divine he is self existant he's equal with the father and I praise God for this study today a man of friends that concludes our presentation for today we do want to close with the word of prayer and we just want to ask that as you contemplate these things as you share it with others don't be afraid to take people to the scriptures don't be afraid to ask those tough questions and don't let anybody shake you from your faith by twisting the scriptures make them read the scriptures as a bus play at play and thus they have the Lord and I think we're going to find that a value that you've seen just as been presented today Patrick or would you close us with a word of prayer police Father God we thank you so much again for the revelations that you give us all throughout your word and truly your word is inspired it's living and sharper than any to examine and I think you more that we have the whole of scripture not just bits and parts and pieces but we can take it as it reads and through it and by the Holy Spirit will guide us into all truth he will convict this of sin and He will lead us to victory and he does that in Jesus so we see more in the threefold testimony of the God we serve and we thank you for that and we look forward to continuing to study this particular topic and we look forward to tomorrow word and so I pray that you would add a blessing to what has been done here that you 2 more have been blessed and received honor and glory as it has all and that anyone who is listening be drawn closer and deeper into the relationship with you for asking Jesus precious wonderful eternal name. 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