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1. Meiste & Nephew- Debt is Dumb

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  • June 19, 2017
    8:00 AM
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Our Father in heaven we are so thankful and that you are the owner of all things and that you have called us to be stewards faithful stewards and as we open your word today as we study today as we learn today may these things not just be shelved in our mind may they be worked out in our hands so we can indeed lives as faithful stewards so bless us today and help the help of technology thing to work if it's your will and if not help us not to stress over it in Christ's name Amen I hope you brought your Bibles and went bring a bible we're going to look at the 1st text today and we're talking about a dead is dumb OK the idea of debt being a dumb thing now that's not just you know a Dave Ramsey slogan if you've anyone listen to Dave Ramsey you know you talk about debt is dumb all the time but this is actually a biblical principle of Proverbs Chapter 22 with me as we dive into this Proverbs Chapter 22 and verse 7 is is the the verse that we typically go to when we're talking about the issue of debt now I find that that people who are out of debt tend to really like to stand in the soap box and people are in debt kind of like to stay away from it because it's like oh yeah you know because I'm in debt right well and this applies to all of us whether you're in debt or not because this is Biblical and whether you agree with it or not doesn't matter this is truth right so you may say well and though it's not that no it is because the Bible says in verse 7 of Proverbs 22 it says the rich rule over the poor and the borrower is what. Slave our servant to the lender the word servant there is bondage when you are in debt you are in bondage The Bible says Now Jesus came to do what did you come to do to set the captives free set those who are in bondage free and when you read the Gospels like in John 8 tells us there that the truth will set us free and that tells us that Jesus sets us free and he is the way the truth and a life right so when he wants to set us free from his not just the bondage of sin but he wants to set us free from the other bondage is that Satan wants to put us in in 1 of those is debt OK go to Proverbs Chapter $28.00 with me in private Chapter $28.00 in verse 20 this is what Solomon has to say come on in there's a few seats in the back as a couple up here Proverbs Chapter 28 and verse 20 it says this a faithful man will bound with blessings but he who was what's the next word there OK He who has sins or makes haste to be rich will go will not go unpunished I think well what does that have to deal with with this well you know what when you use credit to purchase something you are hastening yourself to be rich right because your not say well I will I will budget this thing and I will over a course of time be able to purchase it I want now right I want it now it was interesting to me yesterday I was at the A.B.C. sale I was helping my wife she volunteered to help there at 1 of the tables our table was the cash table and it was very interesting to me the credit card table had a line that went almost half way down the auditorium the cash table we only had I think was maybe 5 or 6 people that came to the cash table now that you may think what was the big deal well you know what it is. As it's incredibly well some of those people may be pain and off every month well OK but most is going to talk to this I'm sure is that you know you buy more when you use plastic as you buy things you don't really need but here the Bible says that those who hasten to gain wealth those who hasten to get material think those who hastened to get to pile it up and says there that they will not go unpunished is a punishment that comes with not waiting but not budgeting the not putting aside a little money every month and then getting used to be a thing when I was a kid called layaway some years ever hear that. New generation maybe never heard of that. But it used to be that OK you go to Kmart and then laid away and you pay pay. And finally you could get it but we don't live in that world anymore as we want every thing right now right now in K. go to Proverbs Chapter 13 and I got to be careful here because I don't want to take Melissa's time but there are some things that when you look at Proverbs Chapter 13 verse 11 and says their wealth gained by dishonesty what diminish and then what it what does Solomon say but he who gathers by what Labor will increase. So as a principle in scripture that principle is that you work and then you purchase it's not you purchase and then you work right but we live in a culture we live in a society we live in a country today where people purchase and then they work and that's not God's way because you do it that way you have put yourself in bondage you have locked yourself into a cell. And that's not what God wants me to prophesy says some interesting things here. In Christian stewardship page 272 this is a light says shun the incurring of debt as you would shun leprosy how many of you want to go out the sefer noon and get leprosy no if someone came into this room today and they were full blown had leprosy to the point it was what would you do would you go over there oh oh and hug him give him a kiss on the cheek What cheek is left no you wouldn't we would say Oh hey right you start backing away well we have counsel from God you're to shun debt as you wish on leprosy this is what all she says and this really has to deal with self the now because that's the problem when it comes to debt debt is in crude because you have no self-denial you want self gratification this is what she says and this comes from heaven is home 393 be determined never to incur another debt deny yourself a 1000 things rather than run into debt now yourself a 1000 things rather than run into debt this has been the curse of your life getting to dead avoid as you would the small pox OK so she's referring to debt as a disease Ishi that we need to avoid need to stay away from. Maybe your sin and they say Yeah well OK press a job you know I've got I've got debt I've got lots of debt Well this is what she counsels there she says make a solemn covenant with God that by his blessing you will pay your debts and then oh oh no man anything if you live on porridge and bread if you to save them then 1 porridge and bread he says you'll be blessed because you're not in bondage. So work to get out of debt Melissa is going to unpack that throughout this week give me practical tools and how to work your way out of debt because I don't want to rate don't raise your hand but I'd imagine that probably many of us in this room are in debt I would hope that it would be nice if everyone of us could say now no debt at all but we probably some are and I don't want to be discouraged by that there's a plan there's a way you can get out of debt and K. now this is interesting to me what Ellen White says about debt and this is an admin is home on page 392 when 1 becomes involved in debt he is in 1 of Satan's nets what she sets for the soul so so this thing of being in debt isn't just a material thing it's a spiritual thing now that's why Satan is work so hard to get us to where you know we've got all of our credit cards are maxed out we've got a huge mortgage and you know all these things why because he knows that this is a net and if he can get us in that net he can get our souls. So what that's telling me is we can lose our eternal relationship with Christ if I'm in debt think about it for a moment you're in debt up to your eyeballs the place you're working says now you know what we've got some changes you're going to work on Saturday you know like oh man you know I can't assist Sabbath and then that the voice comes in you haven't. You know working with your job you know that means you can lose your car you can use your truck you can lose your snowmobiles you're going to lose your house you're going to lose you're going to lose you're going to lose you're going to lose because debt is there you could end up saying OK I'll work this once and then I'll work again. And I work again and what you do is you're compromising your relationship with Jesus because now the debt is what is driving you not his principles she goes on to say the fact that you're in debt weakens your faith in tens So the need to this current. Debt is not just a material thing that we can say well that's just over here it's a spiritual thing finances is a space they are a spiritual thing and if we put ourselves purposely willingly in debt Thank you Shelly in debt we are jeopardizing our relationship with Christ and I would encourage you not to do that I would encourage you to just stay where God will want to stay you know there's a sex and Proverbs Chapter 3 and I'm going to hand this over to you Melissa So stay close in your familiar with this passage and listen to this Proverbs 3 verses 56 and 7 and 8 trust in the Lord with all your heart and lean not on your own understanding in all your ways acknowledge Him and He shall direct your pass Do not be wise in your own eyes fear the Lord depart from able to be health to your flash and strength to your bones honor the Lord with your possessions in the 1st fruits of our year increase so your barns will be filled with plenty in your batts were overflowing new wine if we follow the principles that Scripture has laid out that God has laid out for us as stewards There's a blessing that comes with that there's a freedom that comes with that and 1 of the greatest freedoms that my wife and I have found in being debt free is that you can be generous like you I mean there is a need you can give us not when I wish I could oh I wish I could help that missionary Oh I wish I could good it's no longer I wish it I can and the blessing that comes from just being able to. 100 bucks here 200 bucks there that's huge and it just it's liberating so it encouraged by God's grace if you're in debt do everything you can to move out of it if you're not in debt do everything you can to stay out of it OK Melissa let me give this over to you. Melissa I'm with you as do so. Good morning my name is Melissa might see yes I am formally a nephew I am a wife and a boy mom I have 2 boys Cooper a 6 Grady is 4 and they are full of energy just like their dad and I've been married for 8 years I actually by trade I'm a physical therapist and have been a physical therapist for going on almost 2 decades now which is kind of hard to believe in 2000 the 6 I officially branched out on my own judgment in physical therapy clinic which was just me right so I did everything answered the phones did the reports faxed filed and treated patients but our practice has been very blast over the last 11 years and we continue to grow I work very hard not to treat patients anymore actually as I am working on running the practice and I am very blessed by that but I do find that I am a stay at home mom and a business owner so I spend days home was the kids which I love and on the days that I do work there are blessed to spend days with their 3 grandmas So we're super blessed by that so they're being raised by a village for sure and I am super passionate about personal finance and stewardship I started on this journey about 13 or 14 years ago as I was 1st introduced to Dave Ramsey and taking Financial Peace University at our local church now my memory if I go back even before that I remember when my dad sort of listen to talk radio and I member my grandparents always listen to talk radio it was always that am that kind of static buzzy I hated it but I never wanted to ride in the car with grandma because there was always talk radio on or my dad started to listen to it probably when I was about 9 or 10 and I remember him talking about Dave Ramsey a little bit back then and the idea of paying things off in the order of smallest to largest So the next slide. I'm a little take this we'll talk about this in context but I wanted to give you kind of MA personal finance resume so to speak because I am I am a layperson in this am not I am not a financial advisor I am not an accountant I don't have a degree in this I don't even I don't have a business degree and everything I have learned is by listening and reading. I operated our practice nephew physical therapy thus the connection to Uncle Joel for 11 years without ever borrowing money to operate it now in full disclosure in 2013 we did buy a physical space so yes I do carry a mortgage on the actual facility but we've never borrowed money to operate which has been a huge blessing when you're going through things. I have not used a credit card in a very very very long time. Ironically the other night I was at Kohl's to to buy some some can't meeting presenter apparel and they offered me 30 percent off I get in a close credit card and at this point I love savings and we'll talk about that on Wednesday by the way we're talk about getting a good deal which is very hard for me to not get a good deal but I can tell you that it's a principle for me there are things I'm sure in your life that on principle you just don't budge on and this for me is just a way that I live yes I have a debit card and we'll talk about that here in a little bit however I have that down that I have is your credit score and again Admittedly that's about to change we are in the process of purchasing a home which I'm super excited about I have lived in a small condo for 15 years. And in that time I got married and had 2 boys and so it is a lot smaller than it was 15 years ago. And we truly believe though that the space that we're moving into is what's most important to our family and I'll get to that a little bit because that really comes back around to my Our why in our family and why personal finance and stewardship really matters for us and so that will change however that credit score does make things a little bit more difficult and I think we can talk about that more if you like in regards to trying to get a mortgage when you haven't had 1 for 5 years and lastly operating in this business where we are really blessed help other people doing that without having the burden of debt hanging over our head I can tell you gives you a lot more opportunities and helps you weather a lot of storms that happens when you're running a practice. OK So let's talk about why that is. So I did a little research out this probably depends on where you look you're going to probably get a wide variety of numbers but this is what I could easily pull off the Internet so they're saying Nerd Wallet dot com and these stats are from 2016 so very recent the average household has 134643 dollars in debt not including mortgages. That's on right I think that sounds right now think about that though and we're going to get to this here just a 2nd right we're going to talk about what is debt right the average household has a credit card balance totaling $16000.00 I'm going out to dinner and buying clothes and doing entertainment and taking vacations $16000.00 and this is the average right this is the average. Average new car loans are over almost $30000.00 Some families have more than 1 car loan average monthly payments of nearly $500.00 a month so think about what your mortgage payment is if you have a mortgage and think about what your mortgage payment is this is where you live this is something that goes up in value traditionally when you buy a car you drive it off the lot you have just I love how Dave Ramsey sees as you might as well take a 100 dollar bills and just throw him out the window to get the same effect because driving off a lot now again I'm not opposed to a brand new car specially if you're less position to be able to afford it but when you start to see those numbers that is a heavy burden of debt I'm reading a book and I want to bring it with a but I forgot that I am reading through a book called Start With Why by Simon Sinek he has a TED talk that's out there I've not watched it but he really talking to businesses and individuals about the why and this week as we talk through debt and budgeting and saving and planning and giving it should all go back to our why now the why for each of us is going to be a little bit different partially because we're at different stages in our life partially because we have different upbringing we have different values we have a different purpose in life but I can be very clear as I've gone through different things this is my why right here we have we have gone through so many different things I have gone through personally and in our marriage we've gone through a lot of tough things we're talk about some of those this week. I'll probably be a little bit vulnerable and sharing some of the stuff that we've been through but if we haven't made those mistakes in our finances if we haven't learned from them. I don't think we can grow from it we can't make a difference in other people's lives let alone learn to not make that same mistake again so as we've been going through this process of buying a house which has been more stressful not because the buying the house part has been stressful because we've had were applying for a mortgage because we're upgrading a home I've. Been very frustrated by the whole thing but I am reminded by the why our personal why very much is I want my boys to be raised in the country and have lots of space to go outside and play we like I said we've lived in a condo we have great neighbors we live in a cul de sac and they can ride their bikes and and all of our neighbors are mostly retired because I've lived there for 15 years like I said and they've been great but we're going to move to a space that they can go outside and play there we're going to live on a dirt road where they can ride their bikes to the end and we're going to know our neighbors because that's what's important to us and because Christian education is so important to us we already know the path we want them to go on and we know that being good stewards with our money and making those good decisions that's our why that's what's so important to us in physical therapy which is my background my why there is because I think that living in pain is a mess I think that God didn't intend us to hurt all the time whether that's neck pain or back pain or need pain I think that we think that we must be in pain because we're getting old people think I have to live with it. But I think that same principle can apply to our finances why must we always have to struggle why must we always look paycheck to paycheck why does paying our bills have to be so stressful I don't think it needs to be I don't think that that's what God intended for us to be I think intended for Be a blessing we were blessed a couple weeks ago when our church Pastor Sean read as our pastor. Spencer Gene just left us to go work with my own gall look at that. And he was talking about God's original plan of the Garden of Eden it wasn't that it was to be blessed to enjoy the things that God gave us a plan B. was to have to work plan B.. Was that we would have to struggle a little bit more although God says now that I can bless you through that I can bless you and your work he didn't say just sit back lit you know and I'll bless you and bring you everything you need to your door he says there's blessings in the things we do and what we work for but like I said what we're going to talk about this week very much goes back to your wife to start thinking about that what motivates you what is your why when it comes to personal financial stewardship All right so let's talk about debt I'm maturing this bank here so. Now right. I don't think any of these are OK So give me some examples let's talk through this on things that people borrow money for when you raise your hand I won't necessarily assume that that's something that you may have debt and how's that look I will make that will make that fair statement All right so I throw them out when we borrow money on. Real estate and I like how you said investment real estate which is different than your home Correct exactly right so not your primary residence anyone else. A car. Perfect What else do we borrow money. But was at school education Oh there is a huge epidemic in our country toys can you be more specific on what those toys might be. I like that most of those toys are expensive so could you possibly be talking about say a boat in our v a 4 wheeler Yes right people. In the airplane I like that right all things that again are lots of fun right I think these are lots of fun things and a lot of people who have lots of really nice things and I enjoy using them we haven't had the space like I said to story that stuff anything. Very good Christmas gifts and we do borrow money for Christmas gifts don't we. Oh right what outs they take a shit and. Starting a business that's a very good 10000 home improvements. Oh look at all the list is growing self. Do we say and a great deal. All right I'm going to put that I'll put credit cards right because that's where that stuff often goes I don't think we're borrowing our children our grandchildren. Appliances right rent to center those kind of things are borrowing at and I hope you know this is our borrowing money just on money so these payday advance places which is like run from those like the plague like leprosy for sure. Pardon me. Car repair is very good it's not just the car it's car repairs. Health care thank you that's my world please pay your medical bills. Remember to pay them. And that's it we're going to talk about that absolutely pass you were talking about that credit card bill that comes in and all we look about is that number and we don't always process what that is yes. Yes yes right so how do we put that yes that's true right personally or a barn from a family member or we take from 1 area. And give to another right. Yes because that would fall into credit cards right people are borrowing money to eat. Right exactly were exactly how to eat that falls under those credit cards that's good the list becomes very long right and we're going to come back to this because. When we get to the end today we're going to work on identifying where your at personally and that's where this is very personal but look at these things when we go back I don't know 203040 years ago. I don't think people borrowed on this many things right I mean my mom was just saying the other day I think but they bought their 1st house like 35000 dollars maybe in the eighty's that sound about right forgive me if I'm totally off on this. And when you look at what somebody made a week in relationship to that it's not the differential that we see now because an entry level home is well over $100000.00 and minimum wage is 89 bucks an hour we're just not you know the wage gap but we are borrowing and borrowing in Bahrain and what we've seen though is that people want more and more and more or we want I want what my parents have taken 40 years to get appears have worked very very hard a bit of very very good example to me and and they may come up a few times this week so hopefully my mom doesn't listen to this later but I've created a very very good example of you work and as you work for things that's when you can have things when you when we talk about the toys if you want extra you work extra That's what I was always taught right if you want to do some fun things to do a little extra you do stuff on the side those kind of things so look at all those different things that we borrow money we borrow on. Going out to dinner because we don't think about it when we process that stuff so. So my guess is that we talk through 3 of those things OK Not necessarily in that order but I think we've become normalized in debt right to debt is normal if we want something we just go get it like a jewel already said we just I want it now let me get it and I'll worry about how I'm going to pay for that later OK So let's talk about these Spartina Louise 3 things our goal today is not to step on anyone's toes by the way write your profile and insist are your business and God's right that's between the 2 of you I can give only share from my perspective and my example and what we've been through and where we failed and where we have learned and where we have grown but I can talk through these things and hopefully you get a better perspective and hopefully this week as we go through just such a tiny portion of what stewardship is what personal finances is that you'll be touched in your heart that maybe there's some change that you can make have more freedom all right so let's talk about what sort of car loans because I think that that's a fairly safe I'll start in that area so we already talked that car and the average car loan is $500.00 a month and what we have seen is that I don't know if you know anyone or you know. What happens is people who can't afford to buy a car which is what gets them in trouble the interest rates on that 152030 percent their pain on a car that they can't afford. And what's tough is we defy things right I really need this car because I drive $45.00 minutes to work or more because we're going on this trip and that we need a reliable car because I want to get in the car pool with my brother and so I'm going to need at least a 7 seater those kind of things we can put those reasons but we do we really need new do we need payments and I think once you get away from that we have to use to be a Kohl's. We have 1 solid good vehicle and we have a beater I can a couple of years ago my husband's vehicle which was very old but worked and got it back and forth to work the transmission died the trip replacing the transmission was more than the car was worth and so we had some money in savings and we're looking at each other $0.00 you know we could we could afford maybe at 9 or $10000.00 car like OK we have that money but that would deplete you know it would take down our emergency fund and why do we really need it do we need another nice car or do we need something just to get him back and forth the 4 miles that he needs to get to work right because it's close so we went out and found a very reliable car with 100000 miles on it for less than 2000 dollars and that car yes we've had put new tires in and the muffler fell off once. But it just needs to get us back and forth to work and it has been amazing and we have no payments on that and that's very freeing because we worried if something happens to a car if yes there's only Pedia on it but if that car if an accident happens if it gets backed into which are already right it already has some. Some dents in the back and it's right it's a beater but it works great and it meets what we need and so the discussion becomes need want what we're talking about debt what gets us into trouble we talked about this when it comes to self-denial say no the word no is so hard which is what gets us in trouble with grandkids right we mentioned that right no is what's good for us we can say no that's OK mortgages I'm smack dab in the middle of getting a mortgage which like I already said is driving me crazy I have had to produce more pieces of paperwork that I have ever had to do in my whole life and I really kind of feel like we're being punished for doing things correctly. Because we've been debt free because I don't have a credit score big all these different things but what has happened is because borrowing is so normal when you don't do it they almost don't know how to handle it they don't know how to do those kind of things and we're very much looking to borrow less than half of the value of the home a 15 year fixed mortgage all those kind of things that look we're not looking to do a 50 year mortgage which they exist by the way right like right let's be you know imagine being well I'm $41.00 right so getting a 50 year mortgage I don't know that I'm going to be alive in 50 years let alone I hope that I'm not here in 50 years I hope that God has come but all of that hanging over our head. And so those mortgages again what's happened is we keep buying more and more and more because we're keeping up with people that. We're letting the. We're letting the sin of coveting get to us it's very hard and we live in that culture and I don't know if that you know and ma i world as a mom raising kids with the onset of Pinterest with social media with all of these things that are happening it's it's got to look really nice with H.D. T.V. It's got to be pretty has to be fancy it has to be expensive it has to be all of these things and work we're the Joneses now are this totally this family I couldn't even imagine how the job if you're trying to keep up with the Joneses I could even afford that and that's the hard part because we're working so hard and I and I see somebody who has a brand new car and they have a really nice house and they have really nice clothes and I think and how much money are they making because I get caught up in that except for are they carrying around that burden of debt is that way. That they if they had a job loss or someone get sick or come for a bed you know 1 of the members of the family died or something like that could they survive picked last they were time out of credit cards right nobody wants to talk about their credit cards nobody wants to reach into their wallet I had a credit the last credit card I had I was attached to I got it in college and I had had it I don't know how many years it would become attached this becomes easy right it's convenient you always have it with you so let's do something kind of for fun kind of talk through this all right so I have I have a debit card but it's plastic right this is still very plastic a checkbook kind of takes a little bit more work and it's cash OK what would you rather have. Right I don't write a nice Chris said Joel and I said we are $100.00 mi may handle $100.00 bills and maybe we'll check out the room so look at that. So so this just happened this week and tomorrow we'll talk about budgeting which I think is is really all about discipline and telling yourself No and I will say this literally happened Thursday night for me I knew I was coming to can't meeting and I didn't have speaker apparel I kind of mentioned that already as like oh I need to run to the store so I run the calls and I see that kind of works that works and I threw much stuff in the car and checked out and I swiped my debit card now I have plenty of money in our checking account to cover that OK so I am not borrowing money to purchase those clothes OK. However I did think about that number I'm not sure how much money I spent when Thursday night I roughly know which is more than I would have spent otherwise and because of Acacia Melissa spends more than like budgeting planning Melissa as she gets too busy doing things but I swipe that now if I had paused and stopped to have to write a check which nobody writes checks hardly anymore do you still use X.. Yes but lots of people because because in our physical therapy practice we see that I would say 90 percent of what we have is well it just say cards or credit cards once a while somebody's case with cash we don't keep cash to make change because nobody does that and very rarely unless it's to send in their bill do we get cash or I'm sorry checks so a check requires you to pause now if I was saying that the counter. And I had. Say my cash envelope for clothing which is what I want I'm disciplined and on the right path and admittedly I haven't flow it's as if I pulled out my clothing envelope and I looked and there there was only 100 dollar bill in there and my bill was probably 140 which I'm hoping to return some stuff right but I know how that works. I would have not bought every single thing in my cart right I would have that I have a $100.00 that is all that I can spend and I would go No What do I really want what do I really need. Because this is all about convenience This is all about yeah that looks good not thinking about it there's a new thing called Master Pass which I've seen some ads for where I think you take your phone and you connect your card to it and you just do this and that's so great look how easy that is I have a cart full of groceries I went to target anybody except you know target will get you in trouble every single time especially for women and then your husband later when you go home and show him all the stuff that you didn't need comes home you just so you just swing your swing your phone right by it and you're out the door Sam's Club Oh yes this is the new thing at Sam's Club you can just stand everything as you go right because this is convenient you don't have to go through the checkout line you just scan it as you put it in your cart and then you just go out the door because this is because it's great right that's what that's what that's what they're telling you when I walked in the Sam's Club the other week they said Have you tried the scanning go option it's so great and I'm like because they don't want me to think. They don't want you to think about what you're buying they don't want you to process what that is do I need this do I want this is this is going to I'm going to sell us at a garage sale anywhere because I've collected too much stuff because I can't keep up on my house why am I moving up to a bigger house partially because I have a lot more stuff in my house than I had 15 years ago I also added 3 more people but right so it's just the accumulation of stuff but it's all about how do you make it the least painful there is great research out there and I don't have the sources I have heard from reliable sources is that when we use credit cards we spend at least 12 to 18 percent more at least OK So you know I'll throw in 1 more thing in my cart because I'm not thinking about it McDonald's when they went from cash only to debit cards their average transaction went to 50 percent. So in that set of spending $5.00 a McDonald's when you went through the drive through and I'm not judging anybody who goes to McDonald's but the point is that I went to 10 and they're like what a all those credit card fees and the swiping fees because that makes a huge difference if you want to add something so debit cards are a little bit different but I think as I demonstrated right on Thursday night I still didn't think about it as much now I'm paying for it as I go so I am making sure that I have enough money in my account right so a debit card yes does function differently and by the way I do select the credit option because I want them to have a signature I don't enter my pin anywhere and I think that's just a safety feature so I always hit the credit option but that money is withdrawn right out of my account OK However when I go to look at my bank statement later and there's all this money going out. I didn't think about it and tomorrow we're going to talk about I do good old fashion envelopes We'll talk about that tomorrow I love cash I prefer to do cash because it disappoints me and because it also gives me permission to spend and because I'm a saver Yes I would say that you can and I've done this for many years. The very for the. Christmas time if you know where to shop good well Salvation Army yeah so Abe's mentioning here the importance of same thrifty right and we'll talk about that on Wednesday because I love a good deal I love a good deal I think there are so many great things that you can do and how to do that on a budget how to to how. Set boundaries in our spending so so whether or not you have a credit card it's really none of my business it's not that that is your way to spend money what I can say is there. Is that 70 or 80 percent of the population does not pay off their credit card balance every month and and if you think if you go back to the why credit card businesses are not here to help you. Write what I really think about it they're in the business of taking your money and making money on that right they way they charge us interest they charge us late fees they charge charges penalties all those kind of things so no they're not trying to help you they want you to just buy more stuff and it's amazing how many people either go to bankruptcy or collections or all the concept and they're still in business they still manage to make enough money so again credit cards it's up to you I can like I said I On principle now and $0.00 I would have loved 30 percent off right because I could have made my 100 dollar bill go farther on Thursday night however for me it's become a decision of discipline because I know there's that slippery slope and like you had mentioned earlier when we get that credit card bill starting to see what we spent on happened $45.00 days ago it's not an immediate Can you don't have the immediate connection to what you purchased and how much it cost and really counting the cost which I think we're talking about even more this week right counting the cost what does that cost us so think about those things as you're making purchases and as you are spending money so the question really is what if we had no debt while the right would be freedom you would feel so really need think about. What you could do to go back when we go back to the beginning when we talk about why OK think about what is important to you in your life what would be your why and what could you do if you had no. 1 yes in the back just a. Few days in a way you know. Better are. Asked. Votes that are not realized. And. That's right yes. That's right or that's right. I agree I agree I have chills when you when you bring that up so you can hear that over the side of the room she's talking about you could help those who are hungry and cold you can help on a church project you could help all those things going into retirement debt free I think is is not normal anymore and it should be right up if you have a paid for home and a little bit of money in the bank or some money in retirement. Expenses right like you're not worried if social security falls through we're not worried if those kind of things happen we're not carrying that burden around with us and my generation is a massive game just more and more debt and taking it down the road 1 of the things I'm a little sidetracked here. What we purchased that building space I had mentioned from my office if you understand kind of the amortization and how mortgages and stuff like that work right so in business it's very common to get a 10 year loan on a 20 year amortization so let that sink in to you 1st just a minute so I'm getting a 10 year alone. Except it's amateur rise over 20 years Soha How do I know what happens is people refinance and they keep kicking that debt down the road and when I said to the to the business banker So how do I get a 10 year loan on a 10 year amortization because that just makes sense and it's like oh well then you get a better interest rate and because nobody does it and we've already paid off in 4 years more than half of what the building this worse like we're paying extra like because I hate debt I really do yes exactly whenever we can squeeze out we said we couldn't but we had to split up into 3 different ones we said we cannot look for house until we paid off 1 part right and then we said OK then we can upgrade we delayed gratification we told ourselves no because we can't do everything right so that's a think if you have no debt what could you do OK so how do we get out of debt All right so I will hand out here I hope I have enough I love that the room is packed out I mean I can bring this tomorrow I'll make more copies when we're if we're short tomorrow. Or today I should say I can bring more tomorrow hopefully if you don't need this form you could hand it to someone else right I'm hoping you don't need it oh that was that's a separate That's for tomorrow. All right so like I told you all said we want to do practical stewardship this week you need to have some homework right we're going to walk away with some homework this week where I want you to start intentionally thinking about your finances and how that then connects to which is that we get to on Friday when we talk about generosity and giving and that opportunity when God put something on your heart that you can just open your pocketbook and chest give. I will bring more tomorrow if you need that this I'm going to keep walking into this today. Everyone got 1 anyone else anyone else need 1. So so since no idea is really original hardly any more and I won't take credit from this. And it is set up a little bit differently. And no I'm not selling anybody's books I'm not promoting anybody's books I just wrote a few things I've read some of these I've not read all of them. But yes the day Ramsey really advocates for a debt snowball he has forms in the back of this book which can be super helpful but I made it even more simple than that because when we write it down we make ourselves look at it and anything in life we can think about it we can process through it but unless we force ourselves to look at square in the face and say this is my life this is this is my debt this is the burden that we're carrying at home and to make sure specially for those of you that are married that both of you know this is so important because a lot of times in marriage 1 is carrying that burden more than the other because our personality types are different I am way more into this than my husband. This right and we need to you know we talk about money but I mean this oh I just get so excited I want to talk about it let's do this and he's like yeah I'm right on board but I know the numbers and I can whip them off the top of my head I look at those things we need to talk about those things together so part of your homework then tonight this week and again I don't want to see it this is not this is none of our business but go through and write that down and we talked about this to give you some ideas about what that might be. You may have something that didn't make the board but this is a pretty exhaustive list of the things that we may or may not have borrowed money and so certain write those things out so I split this sheet up into 2 different areas 1 just list them all out so you think about it at the top and then prioritize it because personal finance is really all about behavior it's not about the numbers because if it was about the numbers you wouldn't have gotten into debt in the 1st place OK if you really thought about that 37 percent interest you're paying on that you know $10000.00 car you wouldn't have bought it for you thought about what you would you know the interest you would pay on that credit card and if you didn't pay that balance you wouldn't have used it to buy $5.00 a day Donald's right so list those things out and then at the bottom you can reply or ties that in the list of smallest to largest OK And the idea is you start knocking those things out OK you start seeing those in you you might have some tiny ones you may have a medical bill physical therapy practice pay that far. Pay that. Probably say about a payment plan however that's still debt right member payment plans are still debt OK so you're not that 1st $1.00 out that felt pretty good cross it off the list OK Take everything extra put it on the next 2 and cross it off the list then you take what you were put in those 1st 2 put it another 3rd 1 cross off the list all the while your having garage sales getting rid of all that extra junk you bought at Target and you may have picked up a side job. And and whatever else you needed to do right you cut your cable you decided to change yourself home plan anything like that to get that off your back get out of your life because getting out of debt we can't do the stuff that we're going to talk about later this week unless you're out of debt yes or. Yes after the physical therapist. Exactly the lowest amount the lowest amount because it's about gaining momentum and getting rid of that so it's way easier yes you may have you know a $2000.00 debt at 10 percent interest for example and 2 $100.00 at 2 percent interest except for when you knock that $200.00 off you get rid of 1 so rather than having you know 5 chains hanging around your neck you only have 4 it doesn't really matter how much they weigh in necessarily it's that you're eliminating them that you don't write in it when you knock it down to that last 1 which in some situations that's the student loan that's you know. That a big car payment that's that's the investment real estate that sells bigger things but by that but then you've taken all your Because your pain minimum payments on everything so you don't get behind into say current But as you get rid of those then you're snowballing that and rolling that all into the next 1 and that really is which I started with that in the early days too because I think I had a truck payment 15 years ago and my student loan payment and I was like well what was less than the other was like no 1 off the other 1 off you know and slowly work through that so yes absolutely all right so how do you get out of debt quickly intentionally and with a plan. Super important I love this quote There are no short cuts when it comes to getting out of debt. You can't borrow your way out of debt. OK loan consolidation do not to work because it's all about behavior this whole discussion this week is really all about you your marriage if you're if you're married and your relationship with God That's what it comes down to yes or no because what you're doing is you're taking So you say you have 5 different. Debts right I don't are $12345000.00 right you have $15000.00 in debt you throw all into 1 thing so you can get why would you do that 1 low monthly payment. That you then now spread out over how many years OK it's not about where the money is owed it's about the behavior in the mentality associated with debt so if you're like oh how do I lower my monthly payment which is our culture it's not how much does it cost it's how much is it cost me a month. Let that sink in think about that again it's not how much it costs it's how much is it going to cost me a month so it's not that this car cost $40000.00 it's that I can get it for $400.00 a month oh that I can afford but if I think 40 fowls and I can afford that because I only make $60000.00 a year yes and. So so did you hear that in the back so what she just said was they started out as OK but I share this I appreciate your testimony on this yes so she owed around $25000.00 when you bought it and now you owe 3 times that amount. 60000 mortgage because because you borrowed against your equity when you needed thinks right rather than paying for it as she went and I'm not picking on you here and I appreciate your honesty because we all can learn from that right so what we want to have a paid for home that's what we all want to write yes in the back there's a caller. Who wants. To. Yes he's. 70 how many years to own a car payment 84 months 7 years yes exactly because expanse or yes we're talking about car payments fancier newer It's I understand why we now are renting our phones but I'll get on a tangent here right because I don't need the latest i Phone My phone is dying because I've had it for 3 years and it works just fine except for the battery life is going to make me buy a new 1 though stinkers All right OK yes. There are certain services we're. Yourself. You will go right back words into it yes yes of course you're. Trying. To this is all. That's all about the great controversy this isn't just a separate from it it's right in the mix and knows if you can get us ensnared in this and think that we're doing better oh I've brought all those 5 down at once I'm improving but if you haven't changed your action you're going to be right back in the same things and that's why I'm dangerous very dangerous and that's why I go back here a 2nd again is the key really to getting out of debt is to do it fast and as fast it is intentional it is I hate this so much that I'm going to do whatever I need to do to get rid of it I was once said that Dave Ramsey guy you know he tells people to get out that get 2nd jobs forever right so that you're not spending time with your family right spending time with our family is important but when you're carrying this debt it makes you going to work it makes your spouse going to work a burden like and you're not you're not a good team member you're not a good employer no good you're not a good member of the church you're right because you have this whole way I knew so the idea is it is about behavior changes and that's where we're going to tomorrow we'll talk about that a lot and and Wednesday when my favorite thanks to saving is how do we start then changing our habits because get it yeah it's got to be fast we we don't want this around forever most people who really get intentional get that do it in $18.00 to $24.00 months. And it has nothing to do with income it's nothing to do if you make $800000.00 or $80000.00 or $40000.00 I've heard stories of people who like he is a. Pizza delivery man and right and his wife and kids stay home and they had some debt and he just worked a tail off and then their reward was he might get an extra pizza at the end of the night at midnight when he got home they'd have pizza together and they were so excited but they didn't do it very long it was like a year or 2 and sure I think they had only like 10 only right forgive me for saying that 10 or $12000.00 worth of debt and he made 30 or $40000.00 a year but they did it in like a year research think about that they worked hard and they got rid of it and I was so inspired when I heard that story because it doesn't have anything to do with how much money you make it's your willingness in New York just distaste for having that debt so let me tell you a story here. And I am telling the story with permission of my husband so this is my husband met. We met because we both really like softball. That is how we met and our story is it is not a fairy tale it is not this dramatic love story like he is good for me I couldn't I would not be here right now if it wasn't for him because he is managing the kids and he is a great dad and so supportive of me I could not do what I do as a physical therapist as a business owner if it wasn't for him I know that with my whole heart pastor Gene I might cry here now but I just thought about the fact that you're in the room who sorry it's going to take me a minute. If you weren't here I would be much better. Right. Which is why your pastors are just a part of your story pastor Craig Harris married us and dedicated our oldest son pastor Gene walked through this with us and dedicated my next son and and my uncle Joel's been with me your whole life on February 8th 2013 my husband got fired. I had a 6 month old and a 2 year old and it was a Friday afternoon. And I had no idea that my really good good man great husband great father had made some poor choices and his an unemployment that got him fired and he deserved to be fired and his employer was amazing and to this day we have the greatest amount of respect for those people that company we still do business with them they are wonderful wonderful people but the devil works hard to get at each 1 of us in a different way right he he finds a way to get in and he keeps wiggling and wiggling wiggling at people make bad choices but that's not the point of the story as we have been through a long journey and we had great support through that but the the point of this story in this context is we had paid off our mortgage 5 months before that we had 0 debt I had we hadn't used a credit card I think at all in our marriage and at that point we'd been married 4 years. We had to some savings in the bank and I know we had been investing up to that point me to put that on hold right because life just kind of changed right at that point and so for the next let's say 4 months we worked through stuff we had the opportunity to work on our marriage we had an opportunity to talk through the challenges that we had been through we had an opportunity to take a little bit of time for him to actually find what the next step was for him he didn't have to take the next job he could take the job that was better for him he's been working there for 5 years this month what year is it right 4 years the 4 years this month. He loves the place that he works he's doing well there he loves that and we're in a much better place but what if we had had 2 car loans and I still had student loans and we had a mortgage and we had all those kind of things yes I worked a little bit more after that point in our marriage and I had that opportunity but I don't know what would have happened right what would would we have what what would have happened I don't know but I am thankful and I'm not I'm thankful that we were debt free and I'm out of here saying that I am entered any better than anyone of you that is not at all I am just saying that we had been through some stuff together we had been working on our finances and when that happened it didn't change our world it didn't destroy our world because we could do the things that mattered most and take care of those kind of things and that's really. That's really what the message is about this week the message is. To focus on what's important Bryant if I say that my priorities are God family. God husband kids business and I want to live my life and that priority right I want to remember what not just what but why we do those kind of things so every day somebody has 1 of these. Oh this is your home this is your this is your action item for today everybody needs 1 of these I need another 1. And 1. Back to get 1 of those that are going out 1 yes yes anyone's Oh I hope an enema I'll make more too so this week bring this with you every day this week what we're going to do is we're just have to take a couple of minutes here and then we'll have about 5 minutes for Q. and A We've asked some questions during to thank you for asking those as we went along here well I should just take a couple minutes here so now what. Everyone's going to hear something different today right you're going to be based on your circumstances based on your experience you're going to have some takeaway so give you a few lines there job a couple of notes so so now what how are you going to live your why write down what your why is if you want to think about that so we give our bridges a couple minutes here to make a couple of notes and then we'll go through some Q. and A So the things that Melissa shared with us today. Are very biblical of course and I just wanted to share just 2 more things going back to scripture going back to the spirit of prophecy just to reiterate it's interesting to me what what David says in some 37 he says the wicked bar. Does not repay and when you think about it that's really what. You're borrowing and you're not repay Oh I am making my payment every month when I mean Pastor Joel. Well Pastor Gene and I deal with Estate Planning You'd be surprised how many people have great great desires they put their will they want to leave a low bunch of stuff to the Lord you know be good stewards. Because they didn't live their life as a good steward when they die there's nothing left creditors take it all that's not God's plan God's plan is for us to systematically live a life in harmony with his principles as stewards remembering that he owns it all right he owns it all you don't own anything you don't assure and your back now belongs to Jesus everything does and if you live in that respect OK what do you want me to do do you want me to buy this car do you want me to do this it changes your life when you start thinking that way that this all belongs to me I'm to Stuart I've got to give an accounting because don't think that well you know I'm not a dinosaur whatever no there's a judgement day coming and you will be held accountable for how you use God stuff even after you die OK And this is what Ellen White says. And I've been a stone come back to the whole denying yourself as she says deny your taste deny the indulgent of appetite savior pence and pay your debts work them off as fast as possible when you can stand forth as a free man again owing no man anything you will have achieved a great victory I remember we read earlier saying debt is a is a snare of Satan a trap of Satan to take your soul Christ says if you come to me heavy laden you yoke up with me he says his burn is what lights lights so encourage you. That maybe you're saying you did a thing home man I'm hearing what Melissa saying but there's no buts just yoke up with Christ he will help you get out of the snare he'll cut the net that you have put yourself in and he'll put you back on solid ground and give you victory as a really comes down to him letting him be the Lord of your life not just a part of your life but the Lord of your life you want to make him your Lord today. OK Let's pray together for close Heavenly Father we are so thankful to you that as you have shown us some principles out of your word today that you don't leave us unto ourselves to try to figure this out and to work it out but you have given the Holy Spirits you have given us heavenly angels to minister your grace to give us power to help us and we need help because we want to be faithful stewards for we know that that's the only kind of people that Jesus will be coming for so help us to be faithful in all things and please bless us the rest of the scant meeting and may we grow more in your grace and knowledge of your love in Christ's name Amen. This media was brought to you by audio for years a website dedicated to spreading God's word through free sermon audio and much more if you would like to know more about audio verse if you would like to listen to more sermon leave is it W W W audio or.

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