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Identity: From Culture to Christ

Justin Kim


Justin Kim

Assistant Director of Sabbath School/Personal Ministries and Editor of the inVerse Bible Study Guide for the General Conference


  • July 29, 2019
    1:45 PM
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Father in heaven it's good to laugh father we invoke your name as the creator of culture you are the God of Koreans you are the God of Americans you are the God of all humanity so Father we ask that you continue to give us a sense of humor to be able to laugh about some of these differences and Lord grant us the keen insight to see through culture and to see the kingdom of heaven and to embody the gospel message father should any person in this room not be where we should be in our walk with you we ask that you use this medium and to convict us on all sorts of thing. But we want to dwell with you and even if there is some element in our hearts where we don't want to do away with you we ask that you convert us continually and to allowed our minds and our hearts to to resonate and to to sync up with you we pray in Jesus name Amen so there is a. Artist Chinese artist who grew up in Germany Her name is young she has a whole art exhibit and she was talking about as a Chinese person she grew up in her teens and she felt that she was Chinese going she went to Germany she just experienced a whole different world and she's giving this artistic representation on the differences between east and west the exhibit is called East meets West or mess West meets whatever whatever one meets the other so the blue is the German side and then the red is the Chinese side she writes in Chinese and German and this is even still a this is what the world view the life of the Western person is the individual their frame of reference is always inside out need 1st and then it's not me in terms of theological me it's not selfish it's just the individual is where reality starts from now on the eastern side reality does not start from the individual reality starts from the corporate group and you maybe think how is that possible but this is how Asians function the reality always starts from the group and then comes how does the group view me. Different perspective yes and this impacts our spiritual lives or family and everything so this is where it starts so for example this is a this is a German can't meeting lunch Yes And this is a Korean can't meaning lunch as you see OK Germans in the Western world they believe in individual ism and so different organisations so when you get when we would be distributing something automatically without instructions people get in line one on one up but in Asia that is so inefficient Why do I have to wait in line when I can just go to the eggs and the French toast right and ignore all these people waiting in line it's more efficient now this is tense and it's meant to be humorous but this has Missy a logical ramifications that when there were a Western missionaries that went to China and they're giving out rice all these Chinese came in and it's just like you know. You know just came in as a group and these westerners are like these guys are primitive how why don't they learn to get in line to you know elbowing each other and getting in and whatnot this even happened in Korea where the 1st Ikea Open in one. And I don't know what it is about Koreans and free but he said you know you know when you have it when you and we Americans don't notice it but when you go into in Ikea you have those little survey and those little golf pencils that are really really cheap and it's you use the gulp pencil to write your service but it's free pencils right so these Koreans all went to Ikea not to shop at IKEA but to get a free pencil and this made the International News I'm like why Korea is now affluent they don't need to get free pencils but this Model Golf cheap ones so they all came in they're not waiting in line and they're all in like just all around the small little plastic Plexiglas stand trying to get that pencil is just in the mentality that hate it's more efficient if we all go together and then wait in line but the Western definition of efficiency is everyone get in line and get. Stuff one at a time so it's not one is better than the other but there is a there is a cultural difference between between the 2 another picture is you see here this is your version of self C.E.. The version that Westerners see themselves as like the whole the whole world they Easterners really don't see themselves as individual this is a form of communication that Westerners when they say and they want to get to be they just explain A to B. but for Easterners they have to explain everything else that's going around because they have a holistic way of explaining a certain part of a scenario for example you know I have this interaction my parents are like hey I met pastors so and so today that was all I wanted to say thank you so much I met next on him today and he's like who's that what's what church is he from and where is his wife where kids did he take a plane or did he take of in I don't know any of this information they said I met him today well what time did you meet him it was it after lunch before why doesn't like i just meant him but for him all these details impact his future interaction with that pastor because I make sense and for him he needs to know all of the information to be up to date so that when he has interactions Oh my son told me you took an airplane at 4 o'clock and you're with your wife in the tub and then that helps his future interaction with him whereas for me I was like the least common denominator the nominator information and just straight forward OK there is a little bit of male female dynamics here but there is also a cultural element as well. This is social interactions So for example in a Western context I am friends with these 2 people she's friends with those people friends of it but in an Eastern context we're all friends with everybody and there's no like it was just it's connected so one person wants to do some kind of social interaction affects everybody. Yes or no now this is the basis for a lot of social interactions and Korean church rights and so we my wife and I go to an American you know regular international you know non-Christian church and I'm like hey let's invite so and so and so and so so that's just my mind because I like them let's invite them oh OK but why why haven't the Koreans Well what if what if this person hears and this is this person sister and this person goes is this person Sabbath school and we invite the whole church over I'm like what how did it go from 2 families 2 to 200 people this is this is not the way it should be but this is just the way their social interactions work this is partying. Where in a Western context you just interact with 2 people here and you sit and you go get some food and you know 2 other people there and what not in Western and Eastern context you have coop games. Yes and you need a you need a leader like guys it's now to get game time let's get in a circle and then automatic and Korean Americans it's funny thing even though we're in this paradigm we like that social interaction. Or the other way when this despair died. It's all looking at me like no. We're really like this and it's very interesting that the Korean Americans are hybrid and somewhere in between these 2 things so we went to an American get together and there was no formality no games nothing and I'm just like hanging out with this person and it on and my wife was sitting on the sofa and waiting the whole time she's like. So what's what's the next event that's going to happen I'm like no this is we're just here to chill and relax and hang out and and joy the music enjoy the you know veggie cheese and veggie you know champagne where we were having and she's like so there's no gangs or anything no no and she's like when you should start one. Gave right. But here's the funny thing Westerners like that also you all know there's always that. There's always a Westerner like this is great like this is cavemen and Koreans know and nice not a Korean thing Japanese and Chinese and Vietnamese similar thing they just like this corporate formality to just hang you know very very interesting this is the vision the perspective of the the boss this is called power distance so in the Western cost and context if you're the the pastor or the boss the president the physician you're hired which is a little bit higher and if many ways you call them by their 1st name right by in the Eastern context if you're the person in charge you are super high. And so at the General Conference very interesting that we have you know world meetings coming coming together people from Europe Australia Canada America when they when they encounter elder President elder Ted Wilson who is our G.C. president they call him Hey Ted. It's going on Ted Yeah and you guys know this this is a for them it's a a matter of equality we're that friendly that I can call you Ted Now people from Africa Latin America and Asia I mean they're like. They they bow down and they say they will never say Hey Ted They say greetings in the name of Jesus elder President Pastor Ted Wilson I mean it's just this different interaction Koreans when I see them they're just going to get really quieted in the news and then they get really short and their sentences get really short and just you know a handshake and they don't want to interact anymore Africans go all out I mean it's just the difference is power distance it's nothing to do with education or lack of education there of OK this is when how to interact with a problem so if you have a problem. If this is a very and the Germans me take this even more extreme but if there is an issue to resolve you hit it straight on and the more straightforward you want or you stay for you or the more efficient you are to resolve the issue in the Asian context most likely is if you avoid it it will naturally go away on its. Butt and sometimes it does sometimes it does other times it comes back larger OK And so. Westerners will view this as avoidance Easterners will view this as being too straightforward and always bringing up a problem all the time and so when westerners work in Eastern context we have a Korean American friend of mine she worked at the Korean university and every time there was a staff meeting she would raise your hand like look we've got address this problem this and this and this in this in this in this and how come you as a ministry are not doing anything well number one she just insulted all of them to insult them in public shame and 3 she brought up a problem. OK as you think how do you bring up a problem in this effects church board meetings in Korea you don't go to church board and just mention all your problems they'll just peg you as a problem maker even though you're not the one making the problem you're the one bringing the problem up so they just want to taste it just go away and then the problem goes away with him. So in a in an Eastern context as a different way to bring up problems rather than just raising your hand and doing so this is what happens in old age the westerners you retire and you raise a dog and use enjoy life whereas the sinners you have to raise your grandchildren. So in the in the this is just for me if not all culturally I don't know if this were the effects are going to this for fun in the West if it's if it's sunny outside you're happy and if it's raining you're depressed but in Asia your mood has nothing to do with the weather and my my wife said it's very interesting why do people in the West always talk about the weather like the weather is this perpetual conversation it's a safe thing to talk about always and then you know some some people can talk about the weather for hours and I pray that you do not meet any of those kind of people. So this is another one when you are feeling angry Westerners have an angry facial expression and they convey anger outside Easterners when they're feeling angry they're always smiling OK So there's a disappearance on what's on the inside and the outside now Westerners will view this as duplicitous and fake and having to face to pocker see but Easterners are saying I have to protect all other people from my negative anger whatever so I don't want to share all this stuff out so I'll just pretend Peace smiling and I don't want to play dumb and you want I don't want to burden anyone with my issues so that's all there is that's the difference there when people want an apple they say I want an apple if here she says she's OK but she says she wants some breakfast but she says I'm OK so there's that there's that this and it's I had this issue with my gran my mother in law she came and she said Hey I'll make you food and I said it's OK right and you have to say it's OK probably 3 to 4 times to eat that's a real Korean No but I know it's OK And so I went and she just made this entire humongous meal and I'm like but I'm not hungry. I'm OK And so in my American perspective I just went to my room and I thought maybe she was going to eat or whatever and she had just made it for me and the she was really upset that you didn't even taste that he my food and so she's like you feeling in her whatever and I'm like but I don't ask her to make food I'm not hungry I'll be out eat it later you know just being functional but there is that that that this and it's the other thing is when my father in law a hey would you like an apple and he said no so then I didn't offer him an apple and an illiterate not because of this I live offered and I said if you would like an apple we want an apple farm and he said no so I didn't ask him again and later on I found he was really mad because he wanted the apple the whole time but I didn't ask him a 2nd time and a 3rd time and a 4th time. And so he was like and because he can ask you Can I have that up as that would be a point of shame for him he really said so you can be like well I actually want one so you just they're like waiting for me to ask the whole time so there is a communication issue at the restaurant the Westerners are very quiet Easterners are very loud. Breakfast and dinner in especially Germany is usually cold and lunch is always hot because it's a German thing that's not an American thing I don't think we have cold dinners in America but in Asia every meal is a hot meal especially breakfast you need to have a cuckoo with pop and that's kind of a nice breakfast not this you know croissant with coffee you know it's not a breakfast that's kind of chic and so this is just art art that she just kind of made that really doesn't have any function this is Asia on the left you have. A tea kettle and rice and you've got. A German you know a liter liter shock and whatever whatever that's called a sausage and some beer in the West you know birds are nice to look at in the east you eat them. And eat in the West you enjoy the sun you want to get as 10 as possible in the east you avoid it like cancer so darker skin is considered to be beautiful in the West whiter skin is considered to be more beautiful in the east for entertainment people watch T.V. in the West or streaming online T.V. now but in the east you go to know to bomb. In for for vacations Westerners like to you know look at things whereas Asians take pictures of everything transportation we used to ride cars and now we ride bikes but in Asia they used to ride bikes now they write cars I guess actually changing in China now where no longer people are riding bikes or riding cars which is causing a lot of a lot of issues so this is a little dated but still fun to look at. This is kind of point of reference of time so when you say we will meet at 1030 you know the more American you are and the more. You are to be to Western society you will be there at $1030.00 or most likely $1025.00 a little bit earlier or about Asians consider like oh that's like a pontoon there's a tomb in there which is like really you know 1030 to 11 o'clock is where you should arrive so time is not it's a philosophical perspective the time is not an entity. OK In Greek philosophy time is an actual pen Jubal reality it's measured it's 10 Jubal in a sense and so Greek perspective of the Sabbath is a lot more profound in that sense whereas the Asian perspective as time is a relational entity Don't get too much into it so then Sabbath in an in an Asian perspective is not sundown to sundown an ontological reality but is a relational experience with God from Friday night the perspective but it's comes from to 2 different worlds so here you have this chart in this is from a dissertation from from a guy and there's there's Asian and Western the Asians are situations centered this make them sound the Asians are situational at the says I'm not saying that each situation is different so when I'm interacting with Tom and Susan that is all different interaction when interacting with with Jacob and Helen these are 2 different situations where our whereas in the West it's like I it's me i'm just interacting with them but it's still interacting with them so I'm always the same whereas in Asian perspective you're always kind of changing and adapting to where people are so in go I'm sort of down here but Asians are collective they have a group identity the chief meant of goals is set by others and there's an obligation to the group this is very interesting I'll just mention this is my experience about 3 years ago I got invited to work at the General Conference the world headquarters for the Agnes your church and when I went to my restaurant friends like hate God bless you hey that's that's amazing you must be proud you're It's not an H. even any sorts but people are saying that because they don't know what to say so it was all based on me me me me me my comes from whatever whatever all right whatever when I went to the Corinne perspective. They said we are Peralta Korean people represented a Korean World Headquarters I'm like what. So you are korean I am quoting Korea is now at the G.C.. What. So when they see individuals they are not individuals they are de extension of Korea so even if you're half Korean you're still an extension of Korea in some way so the collective mentality that you your congressman's are not your own if you graduated with medical degrees and law degrees you do it by your so we all help you do it. That's the mental you coming from where is the Western perspective a Korean American men I studied for 8 years and I went through reson I did and can I I pull the I did all that he's in myself and then the parents are like You're welcome you know I helped you with that that's just the there's a Doesn't this sentence in that. And then has an obligation to the group so there's expectation since you are now accomplished and I helped you now you need to help mean back and in from our perspective like why do I have to help you I this is you know that you just create a line and you tell them to go away so there's a difference of that there's a duty obligation is a relation of responsibility duty to others motivation based on obligation OK And this is something that's very fascinating Korean Americans do not know the amount of obligation the Koreans oblige others it is an enormous weight of obligation. In the Western context I mean we may have like one or 2 or 3 obligations and we're like oh is this so much oh this is all much as I was a burden but it is we don't have it to a degree and it's very difficult for us to understand that and we'll talk about that later when that means there's a hierarchy we talked about submissive to authority and some positions in relationships except rules and propriety We'll talk about what that means propriety and there's a passive it's easy and yield in this at here into the social politeness and physis on self face meant this difference is the natural social default net this is what's interesting Crean Americans adopt this whole heartedly OK for example or any prayer question here. Pass. Right I don't want to say no and usually the one that says I do an image and yesterday you know I was at a black church and there was one lady can you pray for my husband he's sleeping around can you pray for my son he's in jail I mean that is not passive ety that is engagement and reality and then when Colin Asian see that these oh no she hopes will. Almost who were he was acquitted they get all we do they say this kind of things but from that world perspective it's like hey I'm an individual I am going through these things so you're asking me for a prayer requests and I will tell you what my prayer request is. But from the Asian perspective is like what is everyone thinking about me he has the prayer request question. What can you pray for my son he just got into Harvard Medical School and we just want to pray for him you know can you pray for my my daughter she just married you know you know B.T.S. boy. And I want to pray for it so it becomes this prayer requests become a little skewed because you're not it's not your personal need but it's a public announcement program that you. K.. But it's very interesting create Americans they take that box and they just really adopt that this is something that they have been born with perhaps that when when when Korean Americans do stick up they get slapped to go back now and so we just been trained to just not say anything in the Western perspective is and this is this was some very very very. You know. A matter of fact individual autonomy achievement of individual girls trained to be individuals so the minute that our parents raised us up to about about when they would go to school they're trying really yes Koreans we were all Korean train when we were a little right but the minute they let us go to preschool I mean I remember one of the preschool I got my name tag with my name on it I mean individuality starts from there you get your own box your own bag you ask a question of what do you think what do you think What's your favorite color so individual is bred into the education so we come back home and as a mommy mommy my favorite color is I don't care what your favorite color is our family believes in and then there's this dissonance of values between 2 OK rights and privilege responsibility to self personal rights motivation is based on feelings there's equality dislike for rules and control play down superiority in fear. R T And you question authority it is a very American thing to question authority our country was based on questioning authority yes England get out of here we are our own people right and so you have this rebellious this that's couched under democracy and Republicanism all that stuff but we are interacting with our Korean parents who are do not believe in rebellion at all. And the last you have self exertion aggressive expressive assertive open and accessible to others so if you like communicate with your hands and you can just articulate really well and use your voice in a specially public speaking these are not really Korean virtues these are very American virtues to have and if you're aggressive and you're forceful and your argumentation kind of think you are kind of scared and if a man well he must be educated by the western side the Korean communication is you know you watch korean pastors Yes How do they preach they stand behind here and they don't move they do fluctuate their voice which is good but it just kind of stand here and they rarely use your hands but if they do it it's more like you know this and this and just just a variation of of this like a ninety's hip hop dancer but it's an American communication is you got to move and interact with people as much as possible so this is a very interesting diagram that this guy came up with. So there are differences of and we talked about our 1st generation in 2.0 generation people and I was talking to Chris there's different you know some of your 1.31.7 I'm 2.00 My wife is definitely 1.00 and now we have our kids and the question is they're not 3.0 they're more like 2.5 because you have if you do the mathematics is what I'm talking about but there's there are social logical definitions of each generation so the 1st generation willingly works hard and by the way I pastored a Romanian church and I've had other other people other other other people groups and there's a difference between Korean. Motherland Korean and then immigrant Korean. And that immigrant Korean is not unique to Koreans it is the immigrant mentality for all nations Japanese immigrants Portuguese immigrants Romanian immigrants there are something about if you're an immigrant you have a different mentality you are you have to have to have some fortitude to leave your mother country learn a new language raise your kids in a foreign land eat weird food and hang out with people who smell differently than you do it's a different kind a mentality mindset to have so they realize they are already disadvantage they are on the lower lower end of society so diligence is the way to excel in society so they have to work hard yes children should show gratitude for those struggles OK this is a natural expectation that they have but here's the thing in the Korean culture they never articulate it to you. Because it's not a direct communication and this is very interesting how many of you and I think this is funny that how many of our churches you have like in you know your member in your old church is that. It like Mother's Day or Father's Day Sabbaths right and then or even on T.V. screen T.V. K.B.'s or N.B.A. or whatever B.S. N.B.C. or whatever there is and then when the parent is encouraged to look into the camera and share some words to their children right this is always very interesting for me because Western parents if they have words of affection or love they just tell their kid right you are special I love you I just you're I'm not I don't know but Koreans can't do that that's almost a violation it's awkward like it's just the 2 of us and we're just I'm talking to my child and it is weird but if there's a camera. And this camera is going to be shown to the entire church I mean and I don't hear very sincere I'm not I'm not saying they're faking it but they say the most tear jerking things here like they hear on the. Motion. And there's a you know oh my God comes out and I'm thinking why are you telling the camera why don't you just tell your child before their perspective they need to tell everyone and that reality is more meaningful than the one to one direction so this camera has I mean techno this why Asians love technology because they can communicate to their children. So children should show gratitude for those struggles so this is this is what I want to say that if you really want to appreciate your parents the Create America. I just love you and I just appreciate what you've done for B. and I'm your most like you present all good I'm going to yeah it's awkward for that OK maybe I mean if maybe your parents are affectionate they'll love you whatever but to give glory back to them or under them you do it in. Public. And money because. The money works the money is the is the 6 love language for Asians. But you do it in public you do it in public and it's just it's the way I mean and especially not on national T.V. but it in there everyone if everyone in their village knows and their village means we're using is a local church that's really their whole world is there a local church so that's that children are children until marriage right children are children are the Western perspective as you were 18 your adult get out of my house I've done my job where as Asians you are a child until I die and I will I will change you until until you die too and then she said no and their mentality is for the sake of the children that's their motto for life. Everything children children children children so 2nd generation comes in and they're all about self actualisation and independence because of our education we are on this journey to find who I am who am I What are my passions what am I call to do why did God put me on this earth what is my purpose in life and our parents are thinking. I came to this country so that you're in so from their perspective they're saying that these are all selfish questions and from that press can do you understand how it could be it's all me me me me me me me but we've been educated in that culture to be that way so there's a little bit of sympathy had the need to go and so we're based on American Western culture English language even even the language itself mimics our culture. So I'm an only child and I saw that when other people talk they said wheel Money dot dot dot dot and I'm thinking mine and Woody is plural right so that must mean there was more so then I would go to church and I would say tall Yale money nail money or my mother and she was a no no no no that's not put in the state. I'm like but I'm an only child there's no other brothers or sisters here. That I know. Why do have to say Woody but that's the polite thing to say so I got. A month. But the plural is a lot it's coming from a corporate collect the perspective and individual so even though our grammar mimics that occurred the Korean language is not Hungry Mile hung Google it's the mud it's our language that's really the polite term to use for the Korean That is very interesting very interesting children began begin D.-Day outside the culture so this is happening in the 2nd generation you have in thinking is inherently Western is inherently Western But the funny thing is this our social interactions are still cook are still Asian but I was thinking it still is Western So we like the group games and we like the social being quiet and different but we think like Western And lastly by 3rd generation they're inherently Western. They're inherently Western they if you keep the language with them they may speak Korean but because their parents are thinking Western they're living in a Western context they're virtually in the you can't differentiate them between. The minority this is not a Korean American pattern this is a Japanese pattern remaining pattern the Hispanic pattern doesn't fit this just because there are so many versions of Hispanic culture and in some parts in America they Spence are actually the majority so it doesn't really fit this to a T. but it kind of does but all the way so you hear stories about you know you know this is. So I mean when we saw her and I and then this is the interesting thing how many of you when you see a career in making it somewhere how do you feel like a little bit just a little bit like. Just a little bit yes or no but if you don't feel that way then you must be thoroughly American and Western but there are still remnants of this in our programming you understand so like kids can all. And you feel this little like. A Korean image or Korean American there's even more of like I'm Korean American She's going to marry so she was giving she was she got the I feel she got the gold Yeah whatever and whatever she's doing and. And and she's telling her story and her story it wasn't like I want to like him and I just put like hours of practice and I think my coach and yapping my wife and I'm sort of so proud I got up everyone else was saying that you know she said I just want to thank my dad you know my dad he woke up like 3 o'clock in the morning every day we drove 4 hours to the practice and he waited for me and my dad my dad and I was like that is such a Korean thing to say yeah not not not blaming around but just sociologically pinpointing that even though she's American She's won the pinnacle of American sports is a rebellious sport and it's and it's the way it's portrayed you. You're a snowboarder or whatever but even vis the pinnacle of American accomplishment at the core she's got some korean this and paying respect back to her dad very interesting so. This is this is really profound and this this this made sense for me OK Western culture is all based on Greek philosophy I'm not going to get into all this right so the Greeks they had this level of peace in their country so they sat around and they what were rows were these philosophers these philosophers had nothing to do sort of sitting on the thinking about thinking and thinking and thinking thinking thinking thinking thinking and they're thinking what is what is this what is reality and what is truth and so the mind set is we need to find what objective reality is whatever that is we need to discover it and when we discover it then we have achieved happiness and this this idea has trickled out throughout all of Western civilization so truth. Truth is the only Western virtue. All honesty accuracy clean being clean you know like this like not not not clean body clean but just you know clean articulation and accuracy precision OK that's what this is saying so that a sense of like an exam in life is not worth living to find your still self think for yourself discovery of reality now Eastern people did not do this. In Asia you have you know these planes and you've got the Chinese empire but within the Chinese empire as Brazilians of empire this and part of this empire this a part of this empire so they have no time to sit around and think about thinking they just have to survive OK I mean they build the great wall because they want Mongolians come down and the Koreans are like hiding in the little peninsula Please don't attack us but then the Russians the Japanese and the Mongolian but there is a Chinese There's a Chinese the move Chinese the Chinese the monks and all these Chinese are trying to attack us so we're just trying to survive right so the philosophy does merge and Asia is that's just get along. Because it makes sense whereas in the West we need to discover her and whatever but in Asia who has just Harmony is the ultimate Asian virtue and I would say this even at the expense of truth. We need to be harmonious whereas the West says at the expense of harmony we need to be we need to be and this is Martin Luther Yeah here I stand and that even though this empire says and I will be done I will stand for truth I mean for me as an American that just makes me feel like you know. You know all the movies like The everyone all if. True whereas in Asia that's not a virtue you're an idiot if you do that. No seriously you are you're an idiot what why are you going to die. Continue to live. The human record only. This is an Asian virtue OK now I'm not saying that these are generalizations you understand OK so here this is the silver rule that Confucius do not do to others what you do not want done to yourself OK and it sounds like what Jesus said but this what they call the silver rule Jesus is better amen because this is this is not proactive it's a passive recruit recess a version of the other version and then so they believe in social structure hierarchy and stability so I want to show you this. OK So this is the West you know truth and that's the east harmony OK just the graphic there OK So this is the basis for eastern Confucian relationships. This is dogma this is even deeper than the 10 commandments pause for dramatic silence OK so one you have the rule verse the ruler OK power distance is very very high you respect your King you're your mayor your whatever whatever whatever father son father is to be reviewed 100 percent son needs to submit to a father no matter what. Husband wife male is always superior to females for a wife to be a good wife she must always submit to a husband and then older brother must always submit to him or to him saying to on the or whatever whatever your version is you know excuse me this is dog not a guideline this is legal social law. And if we just add here to this we shall achieve what harmony bingo. Is make sense to me let me just pause and question then comments any and any and even breathing you want to take here is making sense to a certain degree Now I know you know maybe you might are familiar with this too in terms of theoretical but this now this is the funny thing Koreans don't even know this about themselves like this is part of the old west this isn't an app that they download underplaying this is part of their operating system so automatically if your awoke a woman if there is a man you're like oh no it's just as a present position husband Nick father what it knew what he could be saying all sorts. And then the king could be doing all sorts of illegal scandalous things the it's just dog OK So this is this is really really really dogma this is now it's this isn't like oh you should have a good relationship no off for O.T. is based on this there is no bunking the system when it comes to this. Without question you follow this system you've achieved harmony now you throw some Korean Americans into this this nexus who are like Oh we're all equal I believe in equal rights I am a woman I believe that and I should stand up to my husband and tell him what to do once in a while and clean my floor and. Or when a son or child says no dad that's not what I tell you to believe you know this kind of thing or you're going to go up and be a political against your political leaders I mean that is a threat to harmony now the Koreans aren't thinking like you're breaking the Confucian relationships and we cannot achieve they're not thinking of this you understand but it's in their it's in their framework it's a social sin you're transgressing in that process. And I mean I'm not justifying them I'm the one in us to understand both sides and hopefully get to some kind of resolution here so Confucianism is order in the family brings order to society and so Koreans have always Big been big on family super big on them old Vulture is like the worst thing ever you know the top country for orphans for almost 50 years guess which country that was Korea Korea has exported more kids more orphans than any other country in the world why well there is the human condition has all of its carnal nature and the Koreans are are just as adulterous as any other country don't don't don't know anyone for you OK but because the social structure is so hard there are so many children out of wedlock you guys have heard of the baby box pastor in Korea as a pastor in Korea he just has a little you know a deposit deposit box people put their children in there and he takes care of them children. Family in public must always be perfect husband wife and 2 children right if you don't have 2 children something's wrong with you if you have like 9 children something is definitely wrong with you and you need to have to chew it wide to you know you were 2 when you die you need to replace yourself with 2 more case you need to have 2 right now Korea is in crisis because people are not getting married and we're not going to having and you're having kids but they're not having you know the kids the right order of the anyone or so I'm saying Phil you know piety parental authority and honor I don't talk about that because you guys have been abused by the by a lot you have social hierarchy male dominance very interesting when you look at the cultural dynamics the cultural characteristic of Korea Korea is a very masculine culture. Very interesting thing is America is also a very nasty culture by masculine doesn't mean that men are always awesome I mean just very competitive always wanting the best so these 2 cultures in that sense really align very well so guess what Korean Americans have pressure from the American side to be the best and they pressure from the Korean side to be the best and create Americans have a lot of psychological problems. So we. Want OK So that's the feminine cultures are they don't believe in being the best they believe about taking care of each other and allowing the society to do it and you know that's a culture where the Scandinavian cultures. Norway Finland and Sweden are very feminine That way they don't believe in being the best and by taking care of each other they become one of the best countries in the world so it's an interesting dynamic in that way and they believe in duty obligation I said is a Korean American context they believe on uring the family amongst the community and village when I became a pastor my parents were non or not there like you became a pastor they were not that way I wanted to go into medical route I was doing an internship at Harvard Medical and then when I went to seminary like a member who we were told to look to look through to the ones who would always want us to go and I'm like No I feel called being a bastard so my parents were like kind of all men are like that and then told the church and my local church is like oh man just thing could have been going on up and now you can be a pastor and anyone can become a pastor like that's where all the people if you can't get the medical school go become a pastor that's what people do all right whatever so it wasn't until we started you know G. Y.C. and got big that it got to Korea like news reached Korea and when it reached Korea it got into a little magazine and this little menacing got to my grandmother's house and my grandmother lives in the middle of nowhere on top of a mountainous mill a smaller little village you know little or little Mahmoud. And she's just there and she gets this little thing and so she's like no this is my grandson so she's telling everyone in her village right all these villagers call my parents back home and this is where they're quoting us from right now the case that your son is so that they received all this on or glory from this their frame of reference so G. Y.C. is now exploding on the world we're going to like Africa Portugal you know China and i'm time mom and dad I just got back from my scan and I just got back from Africa and like whatever whatever you're just the pastor just got Argentino you just the pastors pastor but when they got that phone call from a village in the middle of nowhere on some obscure mountain in Korea this was their whole world you know like just did you know all the G.I.'s is going to the whole world that's what I've been saying for the last 9 years. But their frame of reference they can't handle direct communication needs to calm from an outside source and specially if everyone in their core Young knows. Everyone in my view it's no. Now the Korean American context is maybe maybe your parents or yourself we don't have that village system anymore and so the local church has replaced that local village so if everyone in your church knows then and this isn't a clean admin this thing this is I've done this with Presbyterian Baptist Methodist Catholics if their local Baptist church knows we need. To start up and they need to tell the local church. Oh they made it transcend Nirvana and now they're in the good OK that's just that's just their mentality so their frame of reference is that the village mentality they're all about the best education in Korea Oh in America sorry they did a study of the best high schools in America and guess what the Korean communities are in every county where the best schools are in America if there's a bad bad school system there's 0 Koreans that live in that county. The professions of prestige are the doctor engineering business and lawyers I'm sure you already know this no to farmers no to artists no to writers actors and teachers OK So if your mom dad I'm going to be a writer when you go oh no. And it's usually monetary leave motivated obviously right it's money bait and that's that's the reality of it now very interesting that in Korea teachers have a position of prestige. My brother in law is a teacher he's a high school Korean teacher for for seniors it's amazing the level of prestige US universities Court him they give him free football tickets free sports tickets free restaurant tickets to to woo him to get the best students. So these teachers are like these you know superstar football high school football athletes the teachers are not the students the teachers are and but in America teachers make 0 amount of money not very mouther on teachers' unions and striking and so that's too much stress for the current generation so they don't want us to be if you're a teacher a no no for respect to you but not not mean any disrespect taken care of elders is huge and they want you to say you want you to stay in the community and this is the thing. Adventists administers want us to stay in church. Christian Koreans want us to stay in the community so for people wanting to stay in church in church it's not a salvation a motivation it's just just stay in our community that's the pool and I would say that's not a Biblical pool poll you know it should be a genuine fellow I want you to be part of the Save You know not save group understand but you know it should be a salvation motivation that rather just a cultural affinity towards. Asian Korean contacts this is some Korean family got off Google I don't know they are. Do you know them to know that. This is you know that's my uncle Yeah. So this is and so what happens is in the church they they blend. They blend Christianity with Korean Korean ism and then the commandments that they really love which commitment are they going to love. I mean that is Confucian dogma in the Bible hello so many ways Sabbath keeping Yeah you can if you want to that's that's that's recommend but all I know your father and mother that it God said it you better do this when you better keep and I remember when I was in Primary my teacher taught me Honor your father your mother and you know and I would add and all adults that's what God is saying he's implying all adults on or all of them and I'm like that's not what the Bible says no no no no don't question your teacher that's what it says no that's that's wrong that's you're putting words and I quoted Revelation 22 where 21 people in e-mail and it's a. So there's other ones here about honoring your parents they all love that serving others above self because it's a communitarian perspective that if you serve the community that's better than serving yourself so they love that follows in this emphasis on family peace harmony and love. Very interesting to the Christian churches in North Korea the Christian church there are Christian churches in North Korea the official church official state churches when they look at sermons these elements are OK to talk on. So if you think about it the North Korean communist churches may be preaching the same gospel as messages in Korean American churches. So if you have a Bible I want to ask you Can you open your Bibles and someone open really read Matthew 10 and Matthew 19 mark 10 Let's read it really loud and that can really quick OK just be American shouted out be an individual and just be just read it OK no difference here. No you guys are for me with that verse Yes When is the last time you heard that sermon preached in a Korean church. You must hate your mother in law I mean a lot on his daughter was like yeah I want to hear that service it's also OK another one of them are Matthew 19 someone please thank you that is not a friendly verse to 2 Korean Americans yes another 1. 10 Yes OK did that verse is you when you get married you leave your mother and father and you cleaver with your wife that is a big principle OK every Koreans hate this queen Americans are pleading for this verse to come true especially the sons Luke 14 Luke 14 Luke 14 someone please OK so similar verses but you are familiar with that one yes and kind as a kind of we kind of glossed over those were like yeah Jesus just saying hey we need to worship him but he's actually talking about these relationships the social structure needs to be broken and rebuilt on a gospel perspective it does not mean we know mom dad Jesus says I hate you and I'm devout and I'm not going to do that and don't know what it means how do we rebuild is a relationship based on the in the by on the Bible rather than just on a cultural perspective OK spiritual family before genetic family if 2 would want to go there but the point is this. Do you identify more as a Korean or do you find that if I more as a Christian let alone added been asked something Angela said before it was it was very interesting she says that hey we need to pick up all the garbage on this campus because we want people to show people to know how Christian we are Amen but other I know some others are like hey we need to clean up because we need to show people how how clean Koreans are you know so this is like 2 different motivations for the same thing very interesting where is your identity in infusions to Paul is saying this if there is another Christian here who is not korean because Jesus has saved his life and Jesus has saved my life I have more in common with him because Jesus is blood flows in both of us than I do with another unsaved Korean person even though genetically we may be korean we look the same I have more affinity to this person and this trumps anything that does in Korean K B spirit. The There is a. Oh how do you expect there is a certain reticence against fanaticism in Asian culture so hey be spiritual but speech spiritual to degree where everyone else is spiritual but don't be too spiritual Don't go too high just be where everyone else is just cold and just stay there so that and so Jesus is these these verses that we read are very radical and she's like hey if you're going to go out go all out for God and the culture says no well you can just not that much and there's a little bit of tension there and lastly the woman the Bible really defines woman of value in a totally different way we'll talk about that little bit later OK. We're almost finished here we'll take a break here there is precious from our parents one is education this is the slide that the. Really. It really impressed the Penn to parental the older generation they did not know get this please listen to this they did not know that Asian Americans have academic pressure it is a shock anyone or maybe your own genius isn't like well I just I was I got straight A's and now I know we all got straight A's in this room because we're all we all have to pay for our lives depended on it but when we go through college and grad school I mean there is there is academic pressure but parents have no idea what that means they have don't think when it is just graduate medical school is really easy go in graduate become a doctor what's so hard just do it. Once a little it's a hard Yes I mean yes or no yet doctors yes I believe it was. But just as there's pressure grade school prestige and degrees they have no idea about social pressure they have no idea about the football team and the cheerleader and about problems finding a date you know all these things parents are like you just go to school one come out What do you have no idea about any of these other pressures Number 2 there are children adults do not adults do all the decision making you don't have to do make any decisions you just have to and nothing else and there is pressure there because we have to we want to make our own decisions in that process and marriage there is tension where we never actually I never talked about my parents about marriage but they always assumed that they would have a say and I always assumed that they would not have a say that was I was the assumption and we never talked about something assumption assumption that one day brought a Korean Korean girl home I'm going to marry her and her like well no. They weren't expecting that to happen and that there's tension between the marriage process and we talk about staying in a community their version of community is church church is defined as something that's not that spiritual it's not language based and it's not religious and there's this tension in how we define what church really is because our version a church is a spiritual Church it is a religious ritual and there is a language component to that but for them they don't believe in they don't they don't know that and you see the mean here we'll see Mr Mr Kim later on OK. Just pressures about being the minor model minority. We need to be smart and obedient how many of you how many of you by raising. How many were on the smarter half of your class OK the rest of you were on the dumber half of the class. All right so this pressure there have been known to be the mom have you heard the term model minority we use the don't we're not we don't get in trouble we don't talk back to the teacher or we get good grades really clean we take a shower in the morning that can stuff internal pressure with us especially Koreans there is latent perfectionism in us we always want to be the best especially in Korean administers service circles because of certain theologies perfectionism enters this and it gets a little bit kind of out of hand and you can talk about that the history of that and then understanding love we talked about this I was with some some people yesterday they have the 5 Love Languages Yeah what are they there's one of the 5 are Koreans don't use the 5 there is there should be a separate book of the love languages there's only one love language in Korea it's called sacrifice. Right and it's like how much all my guy came up on the you know he has 2 jobs he wakes up at 2 in the morning goes to sleep at like 1 in the morning we sleep one hour and you know she made this keep out of like you know sit it is all yours I mean all this you know he's cutting your fingernails making to keep all whatever makes you cry and whatever makes you just sacrifice that is the love language yes so this is what happens Korean Americans have a hard time understanding the cross. It's sacrifice overload right so all my sacrifice almost like I was. Almost I was I was I was I was I was a hot I was just like I was I was I was I was I was I was I was right and you come to church and in Jesus died for you I'm like no this is too much sacrifice. And tangibly we understand of sacrifice of our parents because we see it intends you believe we have a hard time I know we theoretically understand the cross we get that Jesus died for our sins but to really emotive Lee identify with Jesus dying for a cross the guy in the cross for us it's a little it's we have a different nexus of understanding that and the other people OK there's a pressure of feel logically for us and so we understand grace in a different way because of that and they're under unspoken responsible and this is the last time we'll take a break after this because we don't communicate directly there is these other things that there may be expectations of us but because it's not communicated we don't know what they are so there's this kind of late and anxiety of we don't know but we got to deal with namely one thing is our parents dying how do we go through that how does that how how does the money will process now in western cultures they sit down and talk to mom and dad when you die what do you want well I want my money to go here I want people to care of this will write a will doubt Oh I did that with my mom and dad hate mom and dad when you die how do you want to take care of this. They want to do a good they was good attitude it out of. This is not going the way I expected it to go. I just want to be prepared and like they were. Going to know doing OK but when you say I can't talk to you because you're dead I just I want to be respectful and this is not going to a special way and it was a horrible discussion that we had. And we'll talk about ways and how to do that but they're in an unexpected responsibility and it's and we can't talk about it directly with them even though their mom and dad we can't talk about it all do relationships I mention this the father son relationship is the most defined. And because it is it's the most tension filled in Korean American cultures and when we and when when the 2nd generation has kids often we produce that tension in the next generation if we're not careful we can the mother daughter relationship with Mom and Dad is undefined. And so often daughters don't have and they may have a little bit awkwardness here in their butts a little bit more lubricated than the father son relationship and then the worst relationship is the mother in law daughter in law relationship because it's totally undefined in the Confucian definition when I'm on the daughter gets married she is cut out of her family and she enters into another family and it's not my problem anymore kind of mentality but we don't we don't live in that kind of society anymore so that relationship is totally undefined and we revert to drama or American culture to really fill the gaps and when there's miscommunication that commit some tension there OK a minder standing is when people have adopted an American definition the problems go away but when one adopts American one Korean or it's still undefined you can get a lot of fireworks and very male and can see as a result soul I hope this has helped you in some way I would love to with so to take a 10 minute break we'll take a little bit of a Q. and A and we'll come back for our 2nd half of the seminar is that OK OK let's have our prayer together. Father have in this morning we've talked about some very uniquely US issues Father help us to transcend that and not just ignore it and go become above it but even use these weaknesses. Maybe even consider as a curse Lord that you change your curses into blessings that you choose the weak things in this world weak philosophies and weak cultures and you make them a blessing to the we want to be part of our of your business of changing that so Lord we aren't unique positions so we ask for your blessing to help us to understand these dynamics in a way that honors you and on us our parents and our communities and ourselves we in Jesus' name. This media was brought to you by audio 1st a website dedicated to spreading God's word through free sermon audio and much more if you would like to know more about audio verse if you would like to listen to more service leader Visit W W W audio verse or.


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