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Financing Your Farm

John Dysinger

Description

In this class we will look at options for financing your farm start-up. Grants and loans will be explored — along with tackling the question of whether ewe should be talking government at all.

Presenter

John Dysinger

Bountiful Blessings Farm

Recorded

  • January 17, 2020
    4:00 PM
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Dear Heavenly Father we thank you for this day we thank you for the Sabbath which is quickly approaching and Lord we just pray that you will help us to be able to enter in peace and rest. We think you for all the things we've been learning give us strength and wisdom to apply them and now Lord is re we talk about a topic that. Is. Is maybe leases not as easy for me to talk about as weeding or something but I pray that you would guide and direct us that you would give us the right balance and that you would. Help it to be an encouragement to those who are here. These things re pray in Jesus' name amen. So this is a this is a picture of our farm this is actually a few years ago but it's our little piece of heaven on earth we love it we actually live in that red barn over there on the 2nd story and are washed ation and everything is on the 1st story. And so we have kind of well we've actually. Weighed at one time had more fields over here but we're we're continually downsizing we want to do less and less and do better and this is this is an important point that I'll just make right here. And if you ever get the council's on agriculture book. Mrs White has has quite a number of comments. Directed towards farmers who were trying to expand get bigger and bigger and she said you know you're putting too much energy into your farms she said you need to be investing in Abraham's farm. And so rather than get vigor which just involves all kinds of headaches and hassles focus and she says this to me this is an amazing she says Don't you know that with the blessing of God 20 acres can produce as much as a 100. And so I'm thinking Ok well so if we do the ratios there than one acre should be able to produce as much as 5 right now at one time when my brother was partnering with us my brother and his family we were cultivating around 7 acres and that was that included land that was being covered crop you know so we weren't growing cash crops on all of that at the same time but we've been slowly over the last I guess 8 years or so slowly bringing it down from 7 we're down to right around 2 but we'd like to go smaller still so we have moveable hoop houses over here 4 of those that have 3 positions they can be on and that's where that and these 3 hoop houses here are where we do our intensive vegetable growing that's our best land you know we've invested the most in it then we have. Actually we've reworked this again here we have 12. $3000.00 square foot plots right there so that's basically I mean almost an acre of what I consider that this is where we grow things that most market gardeners don't grow like corn. And okra and potatoes you know most really intensive market gardeners don't grow those crops because you can't make enough on them. But because we can we use our tractor for those and so it's less labor intensive so we feel like we can justify it and again we. Because we do a c.s.a. we want more variety you know you can only give people so much lettuce and. Tomatoes you've got to have some variety so we even grow things like melons which you know we don't make money on melons but we grow them anyway. So that's just a little overview of the farm and you know. As I've said to a number of people here this weekend. We shouldn't have to be starting farms from scratch if we had followed the councils we've been given 150 years ago we would all just be inheriting our parents' farms. And that's a lot easier than starting a farm from scratch I can tell you from experience I know the site leaders are starting one from scratch it's it's a lot of work. But you know we don't we want to be prisoners of hope so even though we may have to be starting from scratch our kids and now you know my son Joshua and his wife and my other son Caleb you know they're at this point they're going to take over the farm. And they're going to have a lot easier then than we did but because they were they were still around when we were starting out hopefully they got enough hardship and privation that. It will carry them through. So I want to start with 4 principles here and this is from Ben Hartmann's book The Lean farm any of you familiar with that book I highly recommend it Ok somebody just bought it you know. It's it's not about how to farm it's about how to farm smart how to farm efficiently and so it's an excellent excellent book and he's got these 4 principles at the end of the book and I can say I. I didn't apply any of these when I started out I don't think but I wish I had so these are all things I learned the hard way. And who was it I guess it was Scott Richmond talking about the 10000 hour thing so principle number one put in your 10000 hours develop personal capacity 1st. You know and there's a lot of things you can do read take class We're talk to farmers you know there's tons of stuff on You Tube now so you can learn a lot on You Tube There's all kinds of pod casts as I was saying a few minutes ago. You know when we started out in the late ninety's Our challenge was we didn't know who to learn from there was nobody out there to teach us so we're stumbling around in the dark. Now you have the opposite problem there's so much information that you don't know where to go it's overwhelming you know so who do you learn from but there's there's a lot of farmers who are doing it very very successfully you know what I can say for ourselves is the Lord has blessed enough that we're still there after 21 years farming so you know at least we say we're supporting our lifestyle of choice you know we we don't I mean most people would say How can you live on your income and I mean I'll tell you I'm not afraid to tell you we we well maybe I shouldn't tell you because it might scare you off. But we live I mean we can we can comfortably live on less than $30000.00 that's kind of our goal $30000.00 you know but we don't owe anything. And you know when you live in the country that's actually you can live quite comfortably on that. If you're in the city. You know for good I don't know that you can live on that well I mean maybe you can but it's going to be hard What's that food stamps. So. I was getting off on a rabbit trail there but anyway. Yeah that's that's what we learned I had lost my train of thought. Yeah right Ok so you know you've got to figure out. You've got to try to sift through it all now but the beauty of it it's out there and there are plenty of people to learn from so you know underlying here work on a farm there's nothing like actually getting your hands in the dirt you know you can read all the books and again I encourage reading the books and I encourage watching that you too but and tell you put your boots on the ground in the farm and get your hands dirty you really don't know what you're getting into and in my opinion. Well let me say this the farmers that I have observed who have hit the ground running and I know farmers who the 1st year they made $60000.00 in the 2nd year they made 180000 dollars that's gross so pretty much across the board. Small farms you're. You're net is about 50 percent of your gross that seems to run fairly consistent now in the early years when you're building a farm you know obviously you're having to reinvest and so you you may not make that but you know our goal is to get down to. 60 percent it's Or I mean we're making 60 percent and 40 percent is overhead and I think once we finish our infrastructure development we can get to that. So you know. Ok well to finish my thought about these farms that that hit the ground running all of those people this guy I'm talking about Bear Creek farms up in Pitofsky Michigan. He had worked on farms for years you know 3 or 4 years he had apprenticed on farms and so he had seen the way different people do it he knew how to grow stuff he knew what he needed to invest in and so when he got his own farm he hit the ground running. So that's really a key now I realize that's hard to you know I mean when you've got a family and everything so that we're talking ideal Now the thing I want to emphasize throughout this is God can make it works even in less than ideal situations because like I said we didn't do any of these we didn't do any of them test in small batches make small mistakes rather than big ones. Again you know we started out with an acre of strawberries Bhuvan you know 17000 plants and we had no idea what we were doing it was it was a big mess it really was so again this is ideal but you know if you want to grow strawberries you know plant a few 100 and see how you do when you learn from the mistakes you are going to make mistakes there's no way around you will make mistakes even if you've read all the books because even they're making mistakes but make small mistakes if you can. Number 3 and this is a big one add infrastructure capacity in small increments only add it as you need it and are capable of using it well boy I have seen this so many times it just makes me sick when I hear I I don't want to mention specific places but there's a school I know. And ads in a school somewhere in this country that was given a lot of money to start an agriculture program and. You know they sunk. A lot of money into the program and. To my knowledge it's it's kind of languishing if going at all I'm not sure but that's that's a story that's often oft repeated. The the most dangerous thing you can do is pour a lot of money into something you don't know what you're doing. Ok so money becomes a curse and I can say this from even our own experience you know when my brother and his family joined the farm we had a very loose partnership but we kind of tallied up the amount of money we had invested into the farm so far and we said Ok if you invest the same amount then we'll be partners so we had this you know fairly large influx of cash all at once. And you know although we we did a lot of good things with it there were a lot of things that looking back I wish we hadn't invested in does that make sense so this is a really key you build the infrastructure as you need it so you know you've got a greenhouse and you're selling lettuce out of it as soon it is you have maxed out the capacity of that and then you build your 2nd one but you don't go out and build 4 right away unless you know you have the market to support it Ok. And the last one here is a void bad debt now you know debt is is a 4 letter word right. And again I have to be careful what I say because I know it's rather controversy over but from my study of the Bible and my study of the Spirit of Prophecy that is not sin. Debt is not sin but debt is not a desirable place to be and if you are in debt you want to get out of it as quickly as possible Ok I think that is Biblical principle so you may have to incur some debt in the process of building your farm but there is good debt in there Badger dead and this is my tweaking of his his definition bad debt is spending money you don't have to finance a scheme you haven't marketed tested and that could easily flop so it's based on speculation speculation is bad debt if you go out and say Ok I'm going to pour I'm going to invest $100000.00 in a market garden because Connor cricket Moore's making big money doing it so I guess I can too right that's bad debt because that speculates you know and you don't have the market you don't have the skills. But good debt would be investing in equipment or infrastructure that will pay for itself in a reasonable amount of time and yield returns for many years afterward and it's based on market demand so again if you know if you have restaurants or people who are saying man I would buy so let me just share this. We. The Lord really opened up the doors for us just in the week before we came down here we have realized and I don't want to get too sidetracked here but our farmer's market sales have been slowly declining over the last few years and I think it's a trend pretty much across the country so we have a very good farmer's market but when we look back at our sales there's slowly declining. And so we're saying Ok what do we do here you know we really don't want to take on another farmer's market farmer's markets are a great thing but they're also a really hard thing. So how do we got a bump up our income a little bit you know we've got we're supporting 2 families now off the farm and our youngest son is wanting to come on board so we've got a we've got a bump up the income a little bit so we just got contacted by a fellow grower who we've worked with some for many years he says you know I'm really phasing out of this my partner got out of it last year would you be willing to help supply the need. You know we we sell about a 1000 bags of lettuce mix and about 50 pints of cherry tomatoes each week and you know. This and this and this and we're saying Praise the Lord you know we can handle that you know but I mean we're talking about 6. $700.00 a week in sales just from this outlet. But the point is you know he's telling us this is what we've been selling so we know we've got a pretty guaranteed market so we can invest more in whatever we need to do to grow that with a pretty good I mean there's no guarantees but a pretty good. Confidence that we're going to get a return on that investment. That makes sense so you see the difference between good and bad debt now don't go out and say I'm encouraging you to go in debt you know but. There may be a time and place where that's what needs to happen Ok so then I've added just a few things and some of this may kind of be repeating but start small and have an off form income to finance your farm. And again we're talking ideal here again we didn't do any of this you know so I'm preaching to myself Here I'm learn from doing it the hard way but if you can again learn how to grow become a good grower before you're dependent on it. And then you can you can take the next step but you know if you go cold turkey. You're going to suffer with drawls symptoms. But you know I have to bring the balance because I believe God calls you does something his biddings are enabling us now you know you've got to be wise you don't want to be foolish but I'm sure there are plenty of people who thought we were not foolish we were crazy. Number 2 look for God to open doors is this his plan for you Do you feel confident that he is calling you to farm for a living and I'm you know I'm assuming you're here we're talking about financing your farm so I'm assuming you're you're looking at it from an income point of view. Ok so this 5 right. Yeah so. If God is calling you to it as reset his biddings are enabling us he's got a 1000 ways to provide for us right. And I'll just tell you a quick story this isn't a direct farming story but it's it's a country living story and it could have been a farming story so I'll try to just really tell it briefly but my brother in law my wife's brother. Came under conviction on country living he was living in the suburbs of d.c. there and he wanted to move out so through a series of providences he felt like God pointed to a specific area in West Virginia. Impressed him that this is the area and so he drew a circle around this town on a map and on their free weekends they would drive over there and just drive around they didn't have money he was he was a singing Well you know what yeah I guess he had remarried this time he was a single father for many years for little kids. But. Anyway I'm trying to make it short here they found this perfect place it even I mean this is amazing it had 2 stone pillars at the entrance it was this is a gorgeous farm in this valley up in the mountains of West Virginia and it had on the stone pillars s. and p. his name was Stan and his wife was Piper. And they said this is it this is for us so they they went into town and started asking around whose land is this and they found out it was. A big investor from the city from d.c. who was buying up all this land I think he had grown up in the area or something so he'd bought up hundreds thousands of acres but he was living in d.c. they got a hold of his number called him up and they had this conversation and the long and short of it is that when he was a kid. He had a grandmother who was an admin asst and read him stories out of the blue Bible story books. And he said Do you know where I can get a copy of those books in the King James Version you know they used to quote out of the King James in stand said Yeah I know I've got a copy Actually he said he said I'll tell you what you can stay on that farm as long as you want free of charge if you'll give me those books. So he lived there I'm not sure how many years 8 years or something didn't pay a penny of rent the guy actually paid him well. The guy put money it was a very old farmhouse and so Stan fixed it up but the guy paid for all the improvements. So just a story one story I've heard many more. Of God's 1000 ways. So look for God's open doors you know I think there's an incredible opportunity in Adventism and I haven't quite figured out how to make it work but there's a lot of aging Adventists who have land. Because they were convicted years ago they were supposed to get out of the cities and whether they ever moved out or not they bought the land right so now you've got the situation a lot of older people elderly people would land who don't have the time in energy and knowledge to do anything with it. And you've got all these young people or a growing number of young people who are saying I want to do this but I don't have land. You see the picture here. I believe there's a way we could try to. To connect the dots. Ok now this is the big one here don't necessarily reject government funding. You know you definitely want to read the 1st fine print you don't want to be beholden to anybody but I want you to consider these quotes because when I read this it changed my whole. My whole way of thinking there's a chapter in in councils on stewardship Well I'll tell you where it isn't just the 2nd but here's here's a couple quotes just as long as we are in this world in the Spirit of God is striving with the world we are to receive as well as to impart favors we are to give to the world the light of truth as presented in the sacred scriptures and we are to receive from the world that which God moves upon them to do in behalf of his cause the Lord still moves upon the hearts of kings and rulers in behalf of his people and it becomes those who are so deeply interested in the religious liberty question not to cut off any favors or withdraw themselves from the help that God has moved men to give for the advancement of his cause so you know don't get so caught up in religious liberty that you turn down money that could be used to advance the cause of God now is having a farm advancing the cause of God Well I hope so I mean that's the goal right that we're giving people healthy food we're giving operated we're getting opportunities for evangelism I believe this is the cause of God. The Lord God of Israel has placed his goods in the hands of unbelievers but they are to be used in favor of doing the works that must be done for a fallen world that agents through whom these gifts come may open up avenues through which the truths may go they may have no sympathy with the work so they may not even be believers at all and scuse me and no faith in Christ and no practice in his words but their gifts are not to be refused on that account you know you can go of the Bible the story of of Jesus and the Gift of The Magic by those who were Gentiles right. Weren't they yeah they weren't Jews so the gents out how did how did Joseph and Mary support themselves in Egypt. It was through the gifts of the magic the wise men. So even Jesus himself took gifts from I guess you wouldn't call them heathen but from. Outsiders. To for his own support so there is a chapter in councils on stewardship titled The wealth of the gentiles I would encourage you if you're one of those and I'm not trying to force my opinion are my ideas on you and if you have strong convictions you've got to live by your convictions but I would just encourage you if you're one of those who is saying no way I don't want to take any government money I don't want to take money from from nonbelievers or any of those things I would encourage you to rethink it pray about it because. From my reading That's what Mrs White is talking about here so let me just give you an example of this and those who live in Tennessee you're you're lucky because you know I shouldn't say You're lucky I don't like to use that word you're you're blessed because the state of Tennessee the Department of Agriculture has what they call the t p the Tennessee agricultural enhanced Smith program the cool thing about this and I just love this it's the best thing I think our state maybe has ever done you remember years ago when they had the big tobacco settlement it's every state got like I don't know you know millions and millions of dollars from the tobacco companies with the big lawsuits Tennessee invested that money. And guess where it's going. To farmers Isn't that incredible I'm using tobacco money that was killing people. To now build my farm and provide people with life giving. Food. I feel really really good about taking that money. So the way it works is you have to and I'm telling you this I know a lot of you don't live in Tennessee but I know many other states have similar kinds of programs so I just want to encourage you to look to your state's they're your state agricultural departments and I'm going to give you some resources later that I think can help you with this and say What do you have for small farmers What resources do you have so you apply every year you you know it's a bit of a house well you've got to come up with a proposal and everything but they're making it easier it actually was easier this year and then you send it in there's a deadline and if they approve and we've been very fortunate I think we've been approved like. Probably close to 10 times and this can be for up to. Your project can be up to $30000.00 and it's a it's a $5050.00 split so you've got to do the project you turn in your receipts and they reimburse you 50 percent of the cost hey. You know. We're building our farm and I can say. Most of our farm has been built with t. a.p. money. Now again we've made some mistakes with that and if we go back to what we were talking about earlier you know it's very easy to think wow you know I'm getting this free money so to speak and so we've bought some things that I wish we hadn't so again you got to be careful not to build faster then you should just because it's cheap cheap money so to speak. But it's been a huge blessing I mean we have 8 hoop houses. And 6 of them have been built with the money. Thousands tens of thousands of dollars. We've gotten from the state of Tennessee the only fine print is that you've got to use whatever equipment you purchased with this for its intended purpose for 3 years now I think they just upped it to for you or is it Ok 5. So if you build a hoop house you've got to use it for growing vegetables for 5 years well that's Ok I can handle that kind of restriction right you know if I buy a piece of tractor equipment I can still turn around it was 3 years or was it 4 years. 3 or 4 years. But they did just upped it to 5 but you know I can turn around and sell it after 5 years. For half price and I just use that equipment for free for 5 years. Hey it's been a blessing to us. The other one I'll just mention here is one that all of you can't now let me back up and just say there are some restrictions on this money you do have to have some things you do have to have you probably know better than I Just because. You know you're kind of newer at this but I think you have to have like to schedule after you all know about schedule asked. If you're farmers that's the schedule you file for your taxes. So you know you can't use it if you've never farmed before you have to have a little bit of a track record you know a couple of years of experience before they're going to invest in your farm because you know that makes sense they don't want to just throw their money away so there are a few little qualifications there they want you to go to some trainings and stuff hey you know I'm all for training so. But the federal government also has the n r c s grants are you familiar with that they're trying to encourage people to build hoop houses. And they will pay and this is not a $5050.00 this is they will pay. Now somebody was telling me they got like 10000 or something we we actually just got another one of those. It's like 7800 or something. Well man I think I got ripped off. Well I'm planning to build a bigger one but they said that was the cap. So one thing I've learned about this and this is just illustrating it is different. Parts of the country it's all about your local person some of them are like trying to give you the money and others you've got to dig it out of you you know squeeze it out of them Hey they say I'm supposed to get this so you know hopefully you've got a good agent that can help you with this. Do you have to be a registered farmer that's a good good good question because Ok. Ok so so he's talking about Georgia you have to have 2 years of evidence and this is a federal program but I can tell you I know of people. And I shouldn't say where because that my point I know of people who are not farmers who've gotten it and I don't think they were dishonest I think it's just that some agents are like I say are trying to give this money away and others are much more Ok there's lots of comments here. Ok so in West Virginia they're a little more lenient it was just growing a 1000 the whole house so everybody's got their experience I want to make sure we get through the rest of it but let's hear from Luke and then Ray. Ok so this is just illustrating the point that it varies. Yes yes there are other thing very good point Wildwood got to hoop houses out of this and I think the whole irrigation system so it's not just for hoop Howells's So again you know this is the kind of thing you don't know how long it's going to last that can change very quickly so I would encourage you to look into it it's through the n.r.a. the National Resource Conservation Service It's called the Equip grants. You know get it while it's there let's use this money for the Lord's work that's my opinion so how much money do you need to start a farm. That's a big question. And there's no simple answers you know you have to do you r.t. own land because that's a whole different ball park if you don't own land and if so what kind of infrastructure is there are there houses are there barns you know is that modifying or is it actually building stuff so lots of things to think about what's your water source like I. You know faith is important but to get into farming without a reliable water source I think borders on presumption. So you know are you going to be able to irrigate your crops. So that can be a big thing it may not be but so I'm going to throw out a number here. But again recognize that. That there are so many variables here I would say in an ideal world assuming you already own land and you already own a house. And you're just building farm infrastructure that you would ideally have $25.00 to $30000.00 to invest in that will put up your starter greenhouse you know you need a heated greenhouse to start your plants that will get your irrigation infrastructure in place that will get you a basic set of tools for Mark you know that's not going to well it might buy you an old tractor but you know the market gardening that I'm trying to promote you don't even need a tractor now a tractor can be nice fact it can be very nice the front loader of a tractor best tool on the for her. But it's not necessary. So. Will you spend a lot more than that on your farm. Yes you will as you build it I mean. You could spend. You know $150000.00 if you built it all at once. But you don't have to do that and I wouldn't encourage you to do that unless you have the knowledge to match your investment Ok so yeah so I'm hoops. I'm almost done here so how are you going to where is that money going to come from well we've talked about a couple of things you know number one Don't underestimate God's ability but you know you can get creative with financing you know I want to be kind of careful about encouraging you to borrow from relatives because that can go south really quick. But there may be. There may be creative financing methods that you can come up with where you don't have to go to a bank and actually it's very hard to get a loan from a bank to start a farm in fact almost impossible. But you know can you can you work off farm you know I'll just put in a little plug for farmer's friend my son's company they've just started uploading a series of videos and the 1st one came out this week on 10 mothers farm in North Carolina young couple starting a farm she worked off the farm and her income you know they don't have kids yet her income supported them and he worked on the farm and so all everything the farm earned they were just plowing back into the farm so they've been able to you know they're only farming an acre or less an acre of land and. It seems to be working you know I don't know their numbers but they've only been doing it a few years and it's going well. So I'm going to point you here. And you know rather than trying to go through all these different funding options this is a really good website that I only. Became familiar with recent well as I was researching for this but beginning farmers dot org beginning farmers dot org And when you go to that website look for funding resources for farmers and there's it's a pretty exhaustive list both government and private both loans and grants and. You know hopefully you can find that you're going to have to do a little sleuthing and a little bit of work and you know you're going to have to jump through some hoops but there is money out there and I will say this as well there is money for I'm trying to you think of some of the terminology they use underserved. Or minorities which of course includes women as well as as people of color. You know I think Native Americans these groups if you fall into the any of those categories it's easier to get funding I think so so go to that website and look at the resources there's lots of resources there and go to the Lord I think I'm going to stop at this point and we can have some discussion Sorry it took a little longer than I was planning but we've got 10 minutes here so let's let's talk a little bit. Discussion on growing hemp Wow. You know I I should say. I haven't studied into it myself. But I didn't feel comfortable with the whole concept when when everybody dived in all at once that scared me and even if I was inclined to want to do it I think that would have scared me off because there's no way all those people are going to make money on it. There's going to be a lot of people that lose a lot of money on him and there's going to be some people that make a lot of money on him. So that's just purely from a market point of view now you know as far as health and moral point of view. You know I would say maybe talk to Larry last year because he said he said he has studied into it and he would not encourage it at all. Ok what about incorporation wow you know. You know again I'm not the right person to do this because I'm not a business person and I really like to keep things simple and. You know of course the whole point of a corporation is to avoid personal liability at least that's kind of how I see it. I've been told by more than one person that. You know if there's if a lawyer is going to try to sue you they're not going to sue you if you don't have anything to take basically. And I know that's rather simplistic and I'm sure there are exceptions to that so I don't want to I have to be careful with what I say here and I think we've got a lawyer back here so actually I shouldn't be saying anything. But you know a small little farm. So they're going to sue you for a $1000000.00. You know they can take your farm but. They're not going to get a $1000000.00 So. I probably shouldn't have said that. But. I think maybe sometimes. I better stop. So I'll just say this we were in l.l.p. when my brother and I were together we was a partnership but because their family kind of moved on with their kids and everything the partnership ended and we just went back to a d.b.a.. A sole proprietorship it's simple you know I mean we were paying a $1000.00 I think in tax for tax preparation for r l l p And you know as sole proprietorship is not much different than personal taxes so it just is so much simpler in my opinion and I better stop there. Ok yeah so so there are some financial advantages and again I would say you know obviously the more you make the more this becomes an issue but you are able to to. Oh I can't even think of the right word to deduct in stuff for expenses by doing that so I don't want to discourage anyone from doing that I just was too quick to share my own opinions. Yes right here and then I see one in the back. I don't know I haven't heard of any kind of official stand on it yeah I think we want to kind of stay away from that for now because I feel like that's going to open up a big can of worms. Him growing. You know yeah Ok in the back. I praise God So he's giving a testimony of somebody who an admin is who had land and was thinking to move out and never happens so now the Lord has blessed him to have to use it yes. To Tennessee agricultural enhancement program probably I should just save that for afterwards if that's only for Tennessee residents but since since many of you aren't Tennessee residents I won't take time but I'm happy to talk to you afterwards on that. Ok while we answered all the question. How do you make a small farm sustainable So this is somebody who didn't you know there's been this mentality out there that in fact it was it's been encouraged by the u.s.d.a. get big or get out. Well it's not true there are thousands of small farms across the country making comfortable incomes and you know some actually doing very well. You know I would I would point to Connor Crick more as probably the pinnacle right now of that he's making big money on an acre just over an acre without any tractor just using hand tools so what are they growing. They're growing. The highest value crops they can and so the reason why they're succeeding is because people across the country are waking up to the fact that our food system is broken. And it's corrupt and it's unhealthy and so they're trying to connect with farms that are local that are again think whether they're certified or not and trying to be able to trust their food again you go to the store and you don't know what you're eating. So that's what it's based on but things you know things that don't ship as well or stores Well you know like lettuces. Greens salad greens. Carrots tomatoes of course are always big those kind of crops there's there's you know really only 5 or 6 big moneymakers lettuce. Tomatoes for us carrots are big beets are actually big. What else any. Any of the salad greens. Kale Kale is a good one you don't make money on broccoli cabbage. Yeah strawberries yes any kind of fruit. Small through is big. Ok I think well take one or 2 more questions and then we'll wrap it up here yes. Idea of how many of my interns have started for our interns and started farms not as many as I wish I can say that Alan Seiler is our star star intern but he would have started a farm whether he'd comes or our place or not so. You know is so not all of them come in wanting to start a farm some of them just want the experience so you're going to have to cut out that group and then the others. It's more. Well I mean yeah there's multiple ones some of them who are here who would love to start a farm but they don't have the means. Help. Yes I would love to you know my my brainstorm and I and some others have a similar idea would be to have. Funding available. You know interest free loans that you would have to qualify you to have to have some experience and some knowledge but you would get a loan you might have you might not need to repay start repaying for a couple of years to get your feet on the ground and then you pay it back and that money then goes to somebody else. Exactly yeah I think that could be huge. To help people get into it yeah a revolving sun kind of thing Ok 2 more and then we're stopping. Sabbaths is coming yes ma'am. Ok so how do you if you're alone how do you get help because it's pretty hard to run a farm alone. You know at Agra is trying to develop kind of a classified thing that I would like to see developed more where you know people who are needing farmers can put up things and people who are in needing a farm or a partner farmer you know kind of a networking bulletin board kind of thing so you know that's one option in even here you know there's that connect board have you seen that by the insurance to the gym people have put up signs. From South America oh outside of America. Wow we there's big potential and big need but to my knowledge there's nothing out there. I'm I'm full of ideas I'm an idea person and I another thing I would love to see is agricultural mission trips so you know you have a need your china start a farm down there a group of us come and help you put up your hoop houses and get your infrastructure in place I think would be wonderful We just need somebody to organize it and make it happen. Ok one more and then will will close and. So he's just pointing out the demand for local food is high and I agree although in certain areas the influx of new farmers is also high so but I would say overall the demand is outpacing the supply so there is a lot of potential We haven't we haven't lost it yet even though we're not the head we can retain the head and not be the tail any longer. So let's pray their Heavenly Father we thank you for the time we've had together here for the discussion we've had Lord you know each person's situation here you know where you want them and I pray that if you want them on farms that you would open the way you open the Red Sea you can open the way for them to be on the farm I prayed that something that was said here can be encouraging to them and that they would move forward boldly but wisely confidently but carefully. And bless this now is really enter into your Sabbath rest in the jesus name men in this media was brought to you by audiotapes a website dedicated to spreading God's word through free sermon audio and much more if you would like to know more about audio version or you would like to listen to more sermon leave it to w.w.w. dot audio person dot org.

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