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Logo of InVerse, 3rd Quarter 2020: Foundations of Discipleship

08-Process of Discipleship - Cultivate

Justin Kim Sikhu Daco Jonathan Walter Callie Williams



  • August 17, 2020
    9:00 AM

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So there is like this thing called the millennial tone where you don't really come down at the end of your senses and you always ask a question even though it's not a question find out more on this episode of adverse. Coming to you from Silver Spring Maryland welcome to the Bible based conversation or my. Temporary is. Broken. Now here's your host just in within. Hey guys you guys are watching interest and we're so happy that you are with us here in the studio and here in this wonderful building with my friends to them in person and one person online and we're so glad that you're here with a Bible study we're in the middle of talking about discipleship So we're now to have a Bible study on Bible Studies at that makes sense and anyway I say hi and say it's so good to hang out with you guys at the time we this is this is we've been on Virtual for a while right we're in those Brady Bunch boxes and this is the 1st time we only have 3 people in this studio but we have Cali on line in Cali if you're out there hey let's go and. You could be with us can you pray for us because we need the Lord's blessing absolutely let's head. Father in heaven we thank you so much for the privilege it is with always to protect Knology to study your work together as we study a previous guided by Holy Spirit we see things clearly we apply them maybe love Jesus more because of our time spent together we ask this in Christ name Amen amen Let's go to to seek who seek who so we've been looking at different elements of discipleship like a while ago when we were we were recording those and now that we're working back into the main theme of discipleship What are some highlights that you remember from this quarter just from for those if you are out there and this is your 1st time watching the show or you feel like men were I don't know what's going to be going on give us kind of a synopsis update for you something. I guess one highlight for me from from what we have studied is the main point the goal of discipleship is to be like Jesus and so it's about spending time with him and then showing him with others so that's probably like high point for me and then in recent weeks we've kind of gone into the agricultural metaphor would it be called for discipleship and talking about preparing the ground and then planting seed I think those are the last 2 lines that we did so just what kind of a lifestyle that you're living like preparing is not necessarily sometimes I mean think about doing evangelism it's like oh you have to go and get a Bible study you have to you know knock on someone's door but there's something that happened even before that just living a Christian life caring about things that are important to other people caring about people that prepares people to be able to receive what you have to tell them about Jesus because they know it doesn't people don't care what do you. Know until they know that you care and they got it. Just to pay you back when you come in I appreciate what you're saying I mean this this quarter we've been really really. Bunking why regular normal. People think. What people might think about discipleship right kind of a program or whatnot and then there's also this kind of spiritual eyes that discipleship and how that fits into church I'm just kind of putting all the pieces and rightfully where they should be and I have a preacher discussion so yeah I love about caring making very organic but bringing into some some discipline in our walk so we're looking at cultivating the stage of cultivating and Jonathan if you can read John John John if you can read John. Chapter 15 and verses one street for yes absolutely it says here I am the true vine and my father is the vine dresser every branch in me that does not bear fruit he takes away and every branch that he that bears fruit he prunes that it may bear more fruit you are already clean because of the word which I have spoken to you. Abide in me and I in you as the branch cannot bear fruit of itself unless it abides in the vine neither can you unless you abide in me I am the vine you are the branches he who abides in me and I in him bear much fruit for without me you can do nothing if anyone does not abide in me he's cast out of the branch and is withered and they gather them and throw them into the fire and they are burnt if you abide in me and my words abiding you you will ask what you desire and it should be done for you by this my father with glorified that you bear much fruit so you will be my disciples All right so a secret you're saying we've been looking at different elements of discipleship we are in the middle of this agricultural grow motif our model and so the 1st stage is we need to be preparing the ground and really we can't just go in and it's been like a you know you don't know my Jesus thing in the you know baptized I mean now you're Christian and we just don't do that that's just not what Jesus did and what he what he right what we've seen in his writings so really preparation of the ground 2nd step is to be planting the Word of God in people's hearts and now to step up we need to be cultivating Yeah and probably the equivalent of cultivating in this passage would be why what or what is what is the word that's repeated by as I by my so explain that what is this a by is this like dissolve by or or what's gone you know and I'm going back I'll go ahead let's go to John and I will go to. All right. Well I like it said here abide in you know have a German background in German language and in Germany there was a word that's used here is to they to to remain to be with connected to divine which is you know Jesus Christ and so it is an element of the relationship and an element of connection and Jesus brings it out here how that happens it is he has to do with his word and so it has to do with connection. Relationship and connecting with his word just as a general overview here and that's this that's one of the main points that I see in this passage about connecting with Christ it means to stay with him and I just took a quick drive by hey high 5 Jesus and I'm a Christian I'm going to go on no it's I'm staying with him and sometimes that's a harder part of my experience we have these like beginning point with Jesus and they were like we do other things but staying in that consistency that's got Cali. Yeah I just want to add to the aspect of how much it takes time because a lot of the other parts you know preparation takes time and implanting takes time too but they can also be seen more of the events versus cultivating as your job inside it requires stain and it requires time and there's no time limit right so cultivating a relationship with someone and some people come to Jesus really quickly for. Longer And so this can also be one of the frustrating stages because you like Ok Are we progressing and even looking at an agricultural way a lot of times these plants are growing under the ground you don't really see a lot going going on on the on the on the top of the soil and you can like Is anything happening I remember you know having spiritual conversations with people and giving Bible studies and outwardly I'm like I didn't like listening to me are they do they love Jesus more I don't I don't know and so to me this is the stage that requires the most the most faith as well as the most attention ology and in agricultural that that that timeframe it's the longest you're saying it's the longest just Bugman waiting and that's just because I just just to go to the verse that Jonathan was referencing invest 711 John 15 Yep it says if you abide in me and my words abide in you that's where you get I think that's probably the clearest that concept of the word what it means he says if you abide in me and my was abiding you it's kind of these perilous statements what it means to abide in Jesus is that my words are abiding in you so to how we still remain with Jesus and this fellowship that we have with him this constant you know staying with him it happens through reading His word right and so it's not a mystical you know only experience it's it's actually staying in the Word of God and that's how we abide with him is and I like that it's actually really practical you know there is there you have steps for how you can do this like if you're. Spending time in God's Word you are spending time with God him down by eating with you no interest in this time in his We're on social distancing we're all separated but what you're talking about is another sound so cliche but this is this is the core of it is it's in the relational development with God right and I want to when you have a relationship yes is relational but it's not it merely intellectual assent it is not merely a on told a logical you know the me you know do well you know I don't know why it. Is there's a I have and this is just you know this this it's not that either it's just that it's just like a relationship and if you look at the most important things in our lives our relationships and selves right and then to develop this relationship with this person that we can't see with our senses. This is where it's at John I think we have to mention the word I think if you were Cally that intentionality we have to just it's a reality that we cannot see Jesus Ok we have the word and that's the gift that God has given us and God has given it to us for a purpose it is not just to stay there it is we have to engage with it we have to take it in we have to memorize Scripture we have to know scripture to apply Scripture and do it in a relationship context of you know prayer Bible study sharing we talked about these elements in this type of ship but you know the Bible says that we need to set our mind on things above set our minds and on these higher realities and taking that with us throughout the day obviously you can rescript through the entire day and that's what Jesus wants to do he wants to spend time with him and then take it with us as we go throughout our day but the intentionality s. important because if we don't make it a habit if we don't take time to to to fill up you know sort of say with the word then we don't really have anything to share either it just occasional you know moment I mean that's good. But it's just one more abiding means to really connect and to say they connected because otherwise if you're not connected you know if you know you will die that's a simple reality then and in this time it's a reliving and I'm speaking of my personal experience we are not good with being fixed on one thing and and being intentional and something you know dedicated to we want to try all these things because there's so much being offered to us but Jesus wants to stay in the Bible I love these 2 things that were taken from a comment one is we need that discipline right so there is energy there is work there is this but you've got to put it into his head. And I don't know the language and he need that you need that that in this and there and you may not immediately get all these benefits like that just pour out but we need that consistency are not our salvation isn't based on that you know but it's it is part of our Christian discipline I mean I'm getting the discipline side of it but it's just also what happens naturally in our life experience when you spend time with someone and it may not even be like in person because social distancing right but like during this time when you not can't necessarily hang out with as many friends all the time but there are people that you're talking to more frequently but the more time that you spend with someone the more the more you get to know how their brain like so you can come to finish the sentences you know like just that time listening to each other and talking to each other it that staying together transforms you like it's just a natural part of what happens in our human reality which when I remember when when my now husband was trying to get to know me I intentionally decided that I wasn't going to spend time with him because I was like if I spend time with this guy I'm going to end up liking him and then if I like him then we might end up dating and you know it was kind of I don't want to go down that road so I would intentionally not try to hang out with him but you guys ended up married because I got married yes we'll find out when come after the break what happened to this intentionality did it become intentional I don't stay with us. Has impressed been a blessing to you Do you have questions comments or feedback you'd like to leave us find us on social media by searching endorsed by or on Facebook Twitter Instagram for you to while there join us like us contest comes up I'll handle again is in 1st Bible no states and now back to the discussion. Hey welcome back everyone we are in suspense this so you guys are married yet you're still married Yeah so but you were intentional not to write because if you get to know Him Yeah but then so then so then so how does he need to convince me to spend time with him by feeding me. And you food yes which is the way to a woman's heart the way. Yeah so and so the more time that you spend together the more I like you know getting to know him and appreciating the positive qualities etc And you know here we are 3 kids later and we still talk. And we still talk and we you know you get to know each other more and before because I had and I would hear stories about oh you know you are married but you stay seated and the day before and I feel like I love the person that I would admit I'm like Yeah right because but I'm starting to get a glimpse of what that could mean is just the more time that you spend together the more that you get to know each other it's like the deeper the connection and with Jesus in an even more powerful way. He wants us to be spending time with him as he's speaking to us and we speak to him it through prayer but he wants he wants us to get to know him and the more we get to know him the more we appreciate him the more that we love him the more we want to tell other people about him as I have a hard time not talking about my husband on the show you know so and I totally appreciate the relational relation of the in a romantic relationship I mean that as analogy or without with I really should with God I totally get that and I think we. We hear that a lot but but when it comes to leadership with God there is that I think that that and she level is that there is that analogy by the certain point in our discipleship we need to also it gets different and I think there is no analogy that is comparable between our Lord and humanity and then and any other you know human human really. Yeah. I think part of part of why that is is what was another human you know both human right but in the relationship with God He is not just perfect but his his knowledge is infinite so having a conversation with somebody who knows this like infinitely more than you know there's no way it's a level conversation you know and and he condescends to listen to kind of say but but what we glean and what we can gain from that relationship thought transcends what any human relationship could have which is why we can we can ask him questions that I can ask my husband and so if it's a different level of relationship we may have to create a new category of relationship which I think many people have a hard time doing it's either comparing it to a boyfriend girlfriend and we know man there are many. Musical entrees that reflect that or a father or mother and some people never get out of that analogy with God They just think them as a parent but it is a new category developed all together so let's go into let's transition into this we counter-weight should go out to the word but I think there is also a maturing in this and then into at the at the top of the show I mean I played around a little and I talk about the millennial tone and everything is like a question you know even though we're making statements all the time and this is very indicative of our generation where we're always asking these these these questions we're not really saying anything you know and you can make fun of that right and so in you using that as a as a as a I don't know what it is as a as a teaser is that we need a space. To ask questions and to develop deeper our our relationship with God And so in our in our in our in our discipleship Yes we are we are reading the Bible but we also need to provide space for other people to ask questions and to be giving Bible studies and not Bible studies or just feeding people information but like hey this is a safe place no judgment Hey let's ask questions and I open here in a how do we how do we do this how does this create into the discipleship can we are bible verse and yes I think we're going to go to 11 chapter one and verse 181-181-9118 here God is speaking. And he says he's giving us an invitation is there one verse 18 and he says Come now and let us reason together says the Lord though you sins of like scarlet they should be white as snow though they are red like crimson they shall be a school and here God is giving invitation to humanity and it's beautiful to see he's saying Come come now this is and invitation to commune to abide to be present with him and then he just let us reason together let us discuss let us well really God is not the one who has to be informed he is the one who is informing us but he's trying to help us understand his will his way he's trying to help us understand as this versus his plan of salvation you know and so. He got invites us into this space and through this experience of not just reasoning but asking questions trying to understand what the words are trying to understand his will and I love that about God He's not just here telling us this is how it is this is how it is this is how it is you know he does give us information but he's willing to engage with us you said he can sense he comes down he's willing to connect with us knowing that we don't understand and then we have trouble grasping some of the simplest things and he's saying Ok I'm going to help you I'm your teacher. I'm going to I'm going to bless you in this but he's Ok with us asking questions he's Ok with us using our brain trying to figure it out it's not just blatant do this or it is I'm going to help you understand this and so as he does that he models for us as His disciples who are supposed to disciple others to model for us a way to engage with people around us helping them understand his work we are not here to just tell people this is how it is we are here to to invite people into a reasonable into an experience of reasoning so that they can get to know God how we do I love these concepts of reasoning in the Taishan and and for me the places of times where I've grown the most was when I was in a safe Bible study in Reno where I could ask questions and then a 2nd place was when I let on a Bible study and I'm I'm feeding what I know from the Lord has given me and in mean providing answers it also has fed my soul as well Kelly what have you what has what has been your experience. Yeah going on back to the idea of asking questions and the fact that Jesus and God and every Holy Spirit there are also welcome mean of questions is indicative of his love and His wisdom because when you know what is right you're not threatened by questions right people are defensive when they're unsure when they feel threatened because. Of all the answers and of all the love and it's fine and similar to you Justin I have felt so blessed by being around people who are not threatened by my questions as well as I think sometimes you know as Christians we can become defensive like how dare you ask questions about God like how do you assume these things but it's like God doesn't threaten so why should we because it is the truth and so we should be willing to share that other people and as you've seen and as I'm sure we've all seen people who respond with Christ like manners are the ones who ultimately when people to Christ because you actually mimic him and showing that there's nothing to hide so questions don't threaten God let me ask the 3 of you will come to see combat I mean let me ask this question How have you all 3 been having grown through I think it's pretty pretty obvious that if we buy a side of the Bible we will grow spiritually that's that's like you know elementary 1st level to not elementary simple but we need to do but the next up is if we're giving Bible studies how how have we how have you grown has it been challenging have your failed what has been some of those experiences I mean I could. I have a friend that I'm studying with right now and just like a week ago she asked me a question that I had no clue I had never thought about it and it's like you know what I have no idea. The experience of admitting that I have no idea and I'm supposed to be the one like you know helping her understand it was humbling and to help me realize that ultimately we come to you know the ground is level at the foot of the cross and when I come when we come into God's Word we are communally asking the Holy Spirit to be our teacher so even if he has revealed certain 2 things to me before he can still teach me even now and I Ok I'm a come back to you next week let me research this and what I can bring to the table in studying with my friend is more experience knowing how to look for answers it's not a monopoly on the Holy Spirit a monopoly on understanding scripture but it's just I guess more time having done so and so in finding that ads are actually what we ended up doing was when we had on that study this past weekend I just said hey here are the bible verses that helped me understand I'm giving them to you go and study them and we'll meet next week and discuss what you found in your Bible study so for me the part of the blessing has been the in Richmond is for one learning through Scripture thinking from a different perspective that I would have never thought about because I've always kind of thought of things a certain way you know them one of the things I love in the Christian Christian structure you are the Euro the higher one there is a lower and you are sharing what you know but it's not higher only and lower only You're also learning to be 2 people in respect to God All of us or servants and students underneath him so there is there is you know we are all at different levels and we're sharing with the people and on a journey but all of us are all on that journey together it's a cool. Equilibrium but not totally the same structure there and you know teachers appreciate this I'm sure they know when you teach you learn the material well as you know he's and so on and this is something happens in your mind but I believe that as we engage with the Holy Spirit in this kind of work. A transformative experience takes place. Well because we are engaging with the Word of God So we are blessed as we share I have the privilege and I want to emphasize privilege as a pastor to study the Bible with a lot of people but what I really appreciate it even though it's a challenge for me personally is to study the Bible with very young people you know young teenagers trying to to share you know I love I love going really deep and having it you know the more complex and yeah you know I just love that when we when it's really like highly intellectual and really you know what to me but when you have to explain the Gospel and these things to a young mind it challenges you to to rethink everything and how how do you how do you share this but there's a huge blessing in sharing and you don't have to be a pastor to do this kind of work it's really a blessing it's part of it I mean that's the key it's a real question has to be every disciple is should be teaching exactly. Ok I think you don't have to have all of the answers in the way and that it's Ok to be asking questions like this actually that's part of your Christian experience and that's what I love about studying the Bible is that it's Ok to be asking questions you're supposed to yes Ok We're not a question we can only get over there. Yeah I was going to add I really especially agree with what she has shared and in my experience not only people asking questions I want to thought of but you feel like you need to understand something a lot better when someone's going to ask you because for yourself you might be like Ok I get it whatever but someone's like No really why is this man I got to be like 17 articles to really understand this and I did read all the Bible verses so that helps you go deeper and other thing is really just see things from a different perspective someone who is coming from a different Christian background or completely atheistic and even though it's the same gospel you explain in a different way and hits their heart differently so even you learn different angles of truth by sharing it with different kinds of people in the questions that emerge for me is every day do I have this one on one time with Jesus to have that safe space to ask these questions about life about purpose about meaning with the Lord Jesus and am I creating this safe space safe space for people around me that we can ask questions and under the grace of God and provide these answers when I encourage you to provide a Bible study space for those people around you thanks for joining us here in verse We'll see you here next week on in verse at the out that. You've been listening to invest a Bible based cosmos a gallery that's wrong with Jonathan passion back. Just. In this is brought to you by the folks that are with television that train just like that and more inspired than ever so it was it embraced the. More I understand also. In verse 5 until next time this is enforced.


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