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Logo of InVerse, 4th Quarter 2020: Education

01 Acquaint Yourself with God

Israel Ramos Justin Kim Jonathan Walter Callie Williams

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What is the point of being educated?

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  • September 28, 2020
    5:45 PM

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Well there it's your doctorate your master's your bachelor's your high school diploma or even your kindergarten diploma What is the point of being educated on this episode of inverse. Coming to you from Silver Spring Maryland welcome to the Bible based conversation or my. Contemporary is. Now here's your 1st just within a very. Long session of education has been around for centuries but what's the point of it there are some who think God needs to be at the center of it and there's others that say God does not have anything to do with education welcome friends we are watching you're watching we're on inverse and we're so happy that you decided to spend the next 30 minutes with us we have in the studio my friends and another friend from very far very far away but she streaming in so happy to see you. In that we are in this new topic new are on the topic of education and before you like it that's where I want to school we're not talking about education in terms of curriculum and home more and degrees but what's the point of it all and taking a deeper look on education especially from the perspective of the Bible so we're going to have a prayer by Cal you can pray for us and we'll get into the Bible absolutely that's. Father in heaven we did you for the privilege it is to study your work together as you look at different scripture as we discussed I pray that your Holy Spirit will guide us and we would walk away with a practical understanding of what the true goal of all education is we ask in pre-op this in Christ's name Amen Amen Amen as we can read this go to Job Job Chapter 22 Chapter 22 Verse 20 Warren 2 well also 3 to 224 Ok for you the whole section there are you living for now acquaint yourself with him and be at peace there by good will come to you receive please instruction from his mouth and lay up his words in your heart if you return to the Almighty you will be built up you will remove iniquity far from your tent then you will a gold in the dust and your gold of over among the stones of the brooks All right so shy so let me ask you so we are in this the Book of Job give it give us kind of introduction maybe some people don't know any about this but we're not studying the book of Job it's pronounced job it's not job right so it's not about jobs and education but we're just looking at what's Give us some background or job was a man lived a long time ago who had a very very brutal experience of losing everything you owned and really almost everyone he loved and so in this experience of not knowing why this happened because he could not see the background of the situation in which Satan was you know trying to get a job to go away from God and job was to have questions and so some of his friends came they talked to him they tried to give him advice some of the advice was not so good some of the advice was good and and job is responding and it's going back and forth and this whole the whole book is really about trying to understand why is there suffering life evil and how do we relate to God What is the connection with God have to do with all of. And so this is what just me in the middle of the book to make you know almost the exact middle of the book here where we receive this really good advice about acquainting ourselves with God that's just a background that's for us yeah this is one of those wisdom books you know that in the Da in the form of a dialogue and it kind of addresses what's the point of life what's the what's the meaning of all this especially as you said brutal experiences that job as like what's the point and different perspectives and it's a long dialogue or as you said in the middle of it you have some good advice as to what's going on here let's let's let's break that text out of it well as Jonathan was already mentioning in the middle of Job's experience with God he's suffering and his friends actually they think that he's suffering because of the sin and the crazy thing is that job's friend is giving him great advice but for the wrong reason and which goes to show that there are some times it's important for us Christians not only to not always focus on the source of the advice but focus on the advice itself is the advice that I'm receiving even though it might be in intended for bad for evil is it good advice and the bottom point bottom line point that job's friend is making here is it's critical to know God and and what's you know how this ties in education is when we talk about education the purpose of education around the world is to make better citizens thinking that if we make better citizens if we educate people if we if we build people up from the time that they're little that ultimately these will be the answers for the success of nations for peace in the world for you know for a for 4 able to side able society lot lower crimes and if you look at verse 21 onward with a critical eye you'll notice there that what we look for in society doesn't come so much from education but it comes from an acquaintance with God which is ultimately for the by. Perspective God's own way of educating Kelly What's been your experience here the Bible says acquaint yourself with him and Israel has brought this in with education has that been your your motivation for education is that a reason why you got your bachelor's master's doctorate post off l o Shipman and you know honorary so much. I mean this is just a sign that we're living in yeah we're always wanting to have those letters after our names and even my son I mean hey let's get it and education is great yeah more we need to know why yes but how does that line up with your spiritual experience. I think at the definitely not all of my own a whole lot of degrees 1st of all but the degrees I do have and even just you know in high school of middle school and going back to kindergarten like you said earlier my motivation at those times were not going to Jesus more on to become more like Christ it was well part of it is kind of just like that's what you do right you go to school you get degrees you're supposed to do well but also the emphasis that I experienced was more this is to make you independent this is to make you self-sufficient and so it actually downplayed any kind of idea of dependence on God And sadly that's a that was even my experience in the Christian education that I had I went to avenue schools up through high school and not the people you know didn't talk about God but it wasn't like you know we need to learn so we can like serve him more is kind of like if you take your science classes and you take your Bible classes and they're separate and there's no I overlap there's no overarching coming to know Christ in all of the classes so yeah just the big big push on and dependence versus any kind of dependence on God and was what I that's a very profound point that in the systems of education that we are in it's not just the knowledge that we learn but you're mentioning that there is some character impact that it's me and here it's made your character to be more independent whether that's good or bad that's not assess it is impacting in a ping who we are and this is what we're talking about in the book of education or the topic of education that this is more than the courses that we're taking a look at the philosophy of education to how to into place with the you know you pointed out earlier that the text here talks about or was it Israel that the things that the world wants God is offering but we have to understand it you know callous saying education and we all experienced you know public education it. Makes you more independent and self-sufficient and all these things and you have skills and whatever you get from it in order to have a stable life in order to build yourself up and. And you have freedom and so the desires of the human heart are for peace and freedom and for stability. So the desires are not necessarily wrong it's just where do we find the fulfillment for those desires and so that we do know that as humans if we focus on humanity alone we will fail because we are single but God is offering Hey I have the true path to the real path the path that will fulfill you and uplift you that the desires are good the desires are legitimate but how to satiate those desires has is what God is trying to address in this situation there's different systems of education and I think the god is establishing in Scripture he establishes his own system of education one system of education says that within yourself we're able to arrive at truth arrive at knowledge and so the way we do the way we go about that is you know we have this through nature we have this the survival of the fittest the fittest people have survived over time and they've survived through the power of physical force and intellectual prowess and these individuals because they've been gifted by nature eventually become professors and schools and they impart truth to us now as Christians we don't believe that but what we what we have kind of the pill that we have swallowed is the fact that we say this we try to merge the 2 right so we say we need to have an understanding of what the world has to offer human solutions and we need to baptize those human solutions with this thing of God Now the radical most of scripture is blows both of those things away what the Bible tells us is that God has a monopoly on knowledge that God has a monopoly on understanding that you know it says that in Jesus is hidden everything meaning and there's 2 things are number one is that truth is hidden in God meaning that it's impossible for us to for. Right it's hidden it's intentionally protected and secondly that if we will ever have any access to truth whether it's the beginning of truth the end of knowledge or anything in between it has to be founded in God And so immediately Harvard and Oxford and any you know university around the world that that is deemed cannot cannot it's impossible for these to compare to what Scripture has to teach and I think that's what the foundation of education from a Christian priest from a biblical perspective is important to know that outside of God You cannot ever find any kind of knowledge or truth you know the irony is that these Ivy League schools used to be bible college and they were focusing on finding the truth from God And so but I think what you're saying this is critical God is the beginning and the foundation for all true education he is the source of of all truth and wisdom and understanding and knowledge and so the beautiful thing though is that is that you don't need to go and study at the seminary and become a theologian you know with a degree to have that kind of knowledge the knowledge of God comes through being a job says being acquainted with him having a connection with him being close to them used to be at the apex of the age of face that to know God and to know all these things are intertwined so Oxford can bridge Harvard and all these the scientists of the eyes of new ins and one has to discover more about God that we didn't discover the heavens in this cover more about the earth and biology in astronomy and all these things would emerge but in today's day we've bifurcated those 2 we've separated the god component we go to seminary for that and that's not academic and that's all spiritual and that's all mumbo jumbo and made up Santa Claus and spaghetti monsters and here this is real education and like you said we've swallow the pill because we've totally are in this paradigm and we need to have a prayer in the beginning or we have a little Bible class and we baptize. Is that when we come back after the break we're going to look at knowing God is the beginning of education but how and as cliche as that sounds What are some practical things we can do to start on this and never of education so stay with us. Has impressed been a blessing to you Do you have questions comments all feedback you'd like to leave us find us on social media by searching ends or spiral on Facebook Twitter Instagram for you to while there join us like us contest comes up next the handle again and invest Bible L.-Space Now back to the discussion. Back you know this this thing of like a knowing God is the beginning but you cation there some of us and we've heard that forever and they're like Hey I totally agree but let's take that a little bit deeper Yeah I mean how many times have you all heard that we got to know God we know God and some sometimes say we know God right and this is kind of cheesy but I know like in Spanish there's those 2 words for no right close and so bad and in German there are 2 words yes and they're kind of Ok so we'll ask that question again yes yes yes there is yes but in English there's only the word know right and hey y'all know Cali like I know Cali but do you know Cali and just because your Instagram friends with her doesn't mean you knew her but I know her I know her parents I've been to her wedding I. Had breakfast at her house and her dad's a wonderful cook and you know so what's the difference between those 2 and then I think in our spiritual experience and the Bible is so clear you know no no no but we take that knowledge for granted and the knowledge is not this abstract knowledge I know that God died for me and God exists and that's not that kind of knowledge so let's get into this discussion that's going to the practicals Yeah I think foundationally speaking the difference between how we know each other and our experience of knowing God is very very different 1st of all in our relationship with each other we're we're getting to know each other on an equal level right learning stuff about you even though I've known you for many years. That I might not have known about you before and vice versa whereas with God God knows everything about us and right Secondly God is infinite so that means that even in a perfect world prior to the fall of Adam and Eve and even in a post perfect world right when when we have been when this world is rehabilitated and we have this once again perfect experience with God we will continue to know God forever and so I think this is the the component what makes the beauty of knowing God is that God is an infinite individual that we have the ability to know and to learn about and to get to know throughout eternity and this is a component that is that's beautiful in and of itself and there's a beauty in knowing God you know there's a day as I'm getting older in age it's cool that I'm getting to don't want to know my parents like I've known my parents for forever because I mean everyone knows their parents or their parents you have known them forever be that's been your but then you see you get to know them on a different level as you get older they're in a different stage you're in a different stage and then I'm getting to know my children right I mean I know my children and my sons but you get to see the nuances of their character and how they're developing it's this is it's a real joy and how a relationship as cliché as it sounds that these these relationships is what really is that is 5 life and provides meaning for time and it's a in this relational dynamics. It is so beautiful because in a connection with God as we have these relations this relationship with him transformation takes place we are in a post fall situation with the fall happened we are sinful we need to be restored and the purpose of true education and you know if we look at it from before the fall took place it was to know God But even afterwards it is still to know God with the added component of restoring us to the image of God which are going to be talking about the next us and so it's it's it's a beautiful work that God is doing. And when we really think about education to education from the Bible really it is just the experience that we were supposed to have living forever in the connection with God This is what education is about because even in a sinless state there's not going to sitting there and we are holding now it is is life we grow in our in depth of of love and of knowledge of who he is because he is infinite and in that experience you know when Satan came in in the garden if he was offering something and saying you know you can no more you can have a deeper experience and he was offering Adam Eve something that they were they were you know kind of desiring which was Noin more you know being in on more about God he says you can be like God knowing good and evil which brings us to an interesting. Point which is still something we'd consider today which is the idea that. You know today is that the more you know the better but Satan is offering more knowledge which does not equate to having a better life it's like if I give you you know if I say hey Justin I'm going to bring you 100 mangoes you know you like mangoes I do have great so everyone of mangoes and 60 mangoes 80 mangoes are rotten you know you have more but is that a value do you really need you know just you want 20 good mangoes you don't want a 100 and so in the same way today's society this world is offering a lot of mangoes and a lot of those are rotten most of them and just knowing and having more doesn't necessarily mean it's better Yeah now you bring in some profound not the mango part but the previous one to prefer profound profound points the temptation of ease for the more I mean we can we can parse that out because she it was not the temptation of the moral of the of the Lear of the more but it was also the dissatisfaction with the current infinite the relationship she had with God and that was like hey you know you're you're in a different spot he was creating a new identity for the right a new identity for God and think there's dissonance and there's There should be dissatisfaction and she was so much somehow convinced of that and then has it but there's more and then the question is I mean that's that's a that's a that's a very concise and it's very profound very contemporary temptation for not just one or 2 before for the vast majority of us if we're honest with ourselves we've reversed reality you know we've made God in the image of God of man and we've made humanity in the image of God we we for example like just the fact that we that we think we know God that that's a minute of itself is a pretty radical thing that like how can how can a finite person know an infinite God this is crazy now the genius of God is that from the very very beginning. So the reason why I say that and the reason why this is so important is because we think that knowing God is a limitation to education like Oh we know God in Bible class right and this solves all of our problems asset in their arrogance and that's and it's so crazy for us to do that whereas God in the beginning says look this is your education your education is nothing else like your education is not biology your education is not physics your education is just knowing God That in and of itself and now we have become dissatisfied with that why we come to we become dissatisfied with that because we compartmentalize God to just being a spiritual being as opposed to anything else and the genius of God is in the beginning your job is to know me this is education we messed that up now what's going to happen well now in a broken that your job is to know me all right we're going to get to know you why so that in the future your job will be to know me and God system of education never changes we change our philosophy changes and God is trying to get us back to that Eden model of understanding and knowledge I want to ask this question but the question itself already is the the the the present position behind it is goes is it doesn't go with what you just said but so many of you are watching out there and saying that you guys are waxing eloquent I'm like why God is the being educated what I mean we've got to learn how to how to fix a refrigerator we've got to make a paycheck we gotta send our kids to school all like I gotta learn how to code because I got to make a living and get that paycheck from monthly pay all this time. But the quite natural question that arises is is a temptation is to make this practical and that's such a wonderful question yeah I mean I mean many of you sent e-mails and like hey we create the path practicality of inverse but even behind that question is not really understanding the root of what you just said. But I'm going to ask you to weigh and debunk the question Ok I'm. We going to know God and we we think we know God yet but how do we know yet how Cali jump in here like yeah we've got to pray more we've got to you've got to read the Bible more but is that what it's Or. Yeah I think part of it is to I'm going to use your word which I don't want to but we need to bifurcate our education. Bring it back to get their oil and that is so yes it is prayer it is Bible study but it's I think a big part of that is just we partition God into different parts of our lives and you know I'm going to learn calculus by myself and then when I need to understand Revelation I'll talk to Jesus but I've told so many my students like God is brilliant in calculus you know how well he can do can't you like he can it's not it's not this or that it's God can help us with everything he can help us learn to code he can help us learn to take our kids to school or to fix refrigerators and so it's just the overarching mindset of yeah like Ok so I'm going to do the rest of my stuff but then how do I focus on getting to know God when really you know Adam and Eve are coming to know God as he regarded me they were coming to know God as they were communing with each other they were comes you know God when God walked with them in the cool of the day it wasn't you know Adam and Eve were like Ok here's the time to me I just know God And then here's the rest of the time to do everything else with my life it was a seamless experience of constant education and walking with Christ he has a very profound point I mean we're getting it's very practical but going deeper I think another way that I see what you just said is is being the sacred in this in everything and this goes back goes back to the job 22 verse 21 now acquaint yourself with him and be at peace that acquainting is not taking place only in like you know during worship or don't we devotional life or just thing prayer sometimes it's kind of like a right check I spent my time with God Now I can do all these other stuff. But what you're saying Cally is like we the whole all of the life you know as we're making this is the show we are experiencing God On another level as our camera brother and here are taking you know our our our our shot I mean they're experiencing some. It's I know we are but that is the challenge that is ahead of us yes on his own into theirs when when Adam and Eve were created by God they had access to the wisdom power and love of God This I mean this is the nature of God is was a power love they had full access to that now would and are short sighted as human beings as is revealed in the question that you asked right because for example as important as calculus is we think all right how is God practical calculus is practical yes and no calculus is not practical in the sense that as much as you know calculus as much as you know you know your m.b.a. even though you know the trends of what's happening society will never will never give you peace and right the fact that through models and through structures we're able to predict how the economy is going to taint that knowledge even though its knowledge will never give us peace. Yet God says I give you peace and so the issue is not so much that knowledge gives you peace but understanding that the wisdom power of God exists beyond yourself is what gives us peace and so Joe makes a very practical knowing God gives a gives a speech it says you know then after you know God he will build you up meaning society could crash he could build you rob me 3 He will remove iniquity far from your tents knowledge can never change the heart of man or the heart of a woman right we would which is educated sinners but God says I can give you a knowledge or the knowledge that I give you is designed to go beyond even just an intellectual understanding to a full transformation as you said and then notice what it says then your purse wrist $27.00 your prayers will be heard then you will declare a thing and it will be a step that success declare a thing and it will be established that's called success in life you will be able to do something successfully it says your light will shine notice what it says in verse $29.00 you will save the humble person even in verse 30 it says even the person who is not innocent then you will also be able to say them so it's just like there is no greater success in Job Chapter 22 no greater success No and there's nothing more practical than success and so what God is saying is you're not practical in in your understanding of life because you think that calculus is practical whereas it's limited and therefore it's impractical you know and things like that yes kind of like I got to digest that when John Yeah the time is running out but I just want to say that kind of on a moment and on what Kelly was saying and knowing God has to do so much more than just this compartment Ok my devotions it is everything around here I mean his spirit is everywhere and he we can experience God everywhere in every part of our life in every aspect of life however you know because we are in a fallen world and not everything is holy and. Everything is God God is a personal being that wants a relationship with us and through that relationship we can see the world where he is working and the things he wants to show us what it is and that connection the relationship that we find to education and that's a challenge that's just before us getting to know God as cliché as that sounds on a deeper on a fundamental more profound level that impacts every aspect of our lives continued conversation visit our social media outlets go to in a verse Bible on Twitter Facebook and all the other ones out there and go to N.P.R.'s Bible dot org for our Bible study guide on the book of education on the topic of education it's a wonderful topic thanks for joining us we'll see you next week here on ars the the earth. You've been listening to invest a Bible based conversation. With Jonathan Sebastian back. Just. In this is brought to you by the. Television that changes like this and more inspiring ever so there's an embrace. Or a. 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