GYC 2009: unASHAMED

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Generation. Youth. Christ. (GYC)

Subodh Pandit:  Come Search with Me, Let's Look for God

Subodh Pandit

The Existence of God

And I usually like to start before time so that at the dot we begin the material.

Grew up in India, which is a land of tremendous diversity, culture, food, dress, language, religion too.

India has the largest Hindu population in the world, over 800 million.

It has about the second or third largest Muslim population in the world.

In fact, we have more Muslims in India than many of the Muslim countries themselves.

Buddhism was born, nurtured, cradled in India.

Christianity came to India at the first generation of Christianity, you go down to the lower parts of the Indian Peninsula, you can still see some monuments to commemorate the landing there of St.

And then there's Sikhism, Jainism, and a whole host of the other religions.

So to grow up in that atmosphere, in that crucible, is really a challenge.

Lots of questions I had and I asked them and after a few years went on a journey and I'm going to describe to you that journey not exactly how it happened but after about 20 years I put all that stuff into a kind of a reasonable, step-by-step approach, and that's what I'm going to present to you today and tomorrow.

It took me that long because I was a doctor, and so in my spare time, what I did was ask a lot of people questions.

And I happened to work in quite a few different hospitals in India, So at some places I was close to a Hindu shrine.

At other places I was close to a Muslim mosque.

I worked way up in the foothills of the Himalayas, not very far from Dharamsala, which is the place that the Indian government gave the Dalai Lama, so his monks would come over to be treated and then we could have a chat.

I worked sometime in the town of Jalandhar, which is not very far from Amritsar where the golden temple of the Sikhs are.

So you know with all these interactions, questions naturally arose and I began asking people, ordinary people as well as leaders, pastors, bishops, priests, monks, mullahs, imams, and it's amazing how when you begin to ask the real questions, how few of them can ever answer you back.

So we're just about 9.30, so let's start.

Some of you would like to take notes, and that's fine, you can take notes, but remember, I'll be going pretty rapidly because of the amount of material there is.

People think that you must just rely on somebody else's words and just by, you know, belief and faith, No.

That's what I'd like to show you during this seminar.

And for those who will take notes, go ahead and try if you can.

If not, I have a book that's just come off the press last week.

Everything that's up here is in the book.

So because I'm a one-man ministry and the ministry is sustained by these finances, I'll have to charge for the books.

If you want to just sit back and listen and if you have a little, you know, something in your purses, that's fine.

Allahu Akbar, that is the Muslim cleric, the mullah or the imam.

He was to call the faithful to Salat, prayer.

Allah is the proper name of God in Arabic.

Shema, hear Israel, 2 words, a Prince of God, Jehovah.

Hear, O Israel, the Lord our God, the Lord is 1.

Namo Amitabha, that is the Buddhist monk.

Somebody who has reached the penultimate state of existence just before becoming a Buddha himself.

And today Amitabha is the presider of a paradise known as the Pure Land Paradise.

If you state his, repeat his name often enough, you will get merit and might be whisked away to that paradise.

There is no other name under heaven whereby we must be saved.

This is the Christian preacher, the bishop, the pastor, and the name he refers to is Yeshua bin Maryam, Jesus the son of Mary, also called the Christ, translated the Messiah.

The meaning of the Messiah is the Anointed 1.

Another 1 of His names was Emmanuel, El God, Manu is Man, God with Man.

Deep in the Indian peninsula from where I come from, Hare Rama, Hare Krishna, that's the Guru which is Shishya, just as they reach the goal of their pilgrimage of temple, Hare Rama, Hare Krishna, Hare Rama, Hare Krishna, Rama Rama, Hare Hare, Krishna Krishna, Hare Hare.

Rama is the seventh avatar or incarnate of the God Vishnu, the preserver of the universe.

And Krishna is the eighth incarnate of the God Vishnu.

So on this side is this religious world, all diverse and varied.

But there's a fence and on the other side of the fence stands the rank skeptic, the avowed atheist.

He looks over at this religious field and with a rice condescending smile he says, these poor deluded souls sitting at the opium of the masses.

Opium of the masses, you guys don't know how to face the reality of life.

It is tough, it is painful, there is suffering there.

And when you can't face it, then you go run off and nibble and chew a little bit on these empty promises of some utopia out there, some God who's going to give you something more than you have.

Oh, so there is some reality that nobody else knows?

So I looked at 1 of the authors who stated why he would not want to be a believer.

A brilliant British atheistic philosopher Bertrand Russell, listen to what he said, it is only on the firm foundation of unyielding despair that the soul's habitation can henceforth be safely built.

Quentin Smith, author of, co-author actually, of Theism, Atheism and the Big Bang Cosmology, this is what he said, he was even more blunt.

The only reasonable belief is that we came from nothing, by nothing, and for nothing.

So my first question was, where did he get such a big sweeping statement from?

There is no way anybody can establish this by any chance whatsoever.

But nothingness is not an easy principle to live by.

And that is why Jean-Paul Sartre, that French thinker and philosopher, after he had outlined all his arguments as to why atheism is the way to live, step by step, argument on an argument, and he placed it all out there and said, look, I showed you the best way to live is live like an atheist.

But 1 question remains, he said, why I have not committed suicide yet.

You know, some of us might smile, but for him it was no smiling matter.

And I'll tell you why he was dead serious.

Just One Way?

Let's go ahead and start, restart, resume.

Circumstantial, the anthropic principle, logical analysis, the formation of granite, and now for a statistical analysis.

Numbers are the hardest forms of evidence that the human mind can grapple with.

Statements and descriptions are of 1 kind.

It's an interesting way of looking at it.

It's also a mathematical concept called probability.

What are the chances that something would occur, what are the chances it would not occur?

In day to day life, 10 to the power of 8 or 100 million, If something will keep on occurring a hundred million times, we say in our own jargon, it's going to always occur, so it's a fact.

If it will occur only once and will not occur 10 to the power of 8 times, 10 to the power of 8 is a hundred million again, then we say it's not possible.

When it comes to scientific evaluation, in other words, when they build these roller coasters or suspension bridges or send out a plane into the sky or a rocket into the outer space, then the principles of some of those things that they use have to be mathematically brought to at least 10 to the power of 15, 1 quadrillion.

In other words, it must occur 10 to the power of 15 times with only 1 chance of failure and then they will use it.

And so if there's only 1 chance of occurrence and 10 to the power of 15 chances of non-occurrence of failure that according to scientific evaluation it is not possible.

When it comes to stating a scientific law, the number goes up to 10 to the power of 50.

10 to the power of 50 occurrences and 1 non-occurrence, the law is established.

1 non-occurrence, rather 1 occurrence with 10 to the power of 50 occurrences and 1 non-occurrence, the law is established.

1 non-occurrence, 1 rather 1 occurrence with 10 to the power of 50 non-occurrences, it is utterly impossible.

10 to the power of 50 is an arbitrary number, but how many of us can grasp 10 to the power of 50?

Let me give you an example, let me give you an idea of what it might be like.

Suppose we are looking at the law of gravity.

I'm going to leave this pointer once per second, looking for that chance in which the pointer will not come down like this, but it will just stay there or float away.

To do it 10 to the power of 18 times will take me 15 billion years.

We told ourselves in the beginning if something impresses you, you just go ahead and say wow.

To do it just 10 to the power of 18 times will take me 15 billion years.

To do it 10 to the power of 20 times will take me 1.5 trillion years.

The age of our universe from the big bang till today.

So you're still going on looking for that 1 chance.

Can you see that 10 to the power of 50 is a huge number?

That 10 to the power of 50 is a huge number.

If all 6 billion of us on the earth were to do this once per second for 1.5 trillion years, we would still be 10 to the power of 27, 28 or something like that.

So all of us trying, we still haven't got that 1 chance.

1 chance and 10 to the power of 50 non-chances means it is utterly impossible.

Sir Michael Denton from New Zealand, I think, was the first 1 to challenge Darwin on his theory of evolution at its origins, the origin of life.

What are the chances that the first cell had 100 proteins in it because we need 100 proteins at the minimum for the cell to be alive.

What are the chances that 100 proteins would get together by themselves.

100 proteins giving a maximum combined probability of 10 to the power of minus 2000 or 1 chance in 10 to the power of 2000.

10 to the power of 50 we say is impossible.

Now, this is a huge number, as it is we said this was big, this is really huge.

Suppose we tell him Sir Michael Denton, I think you made a calculation that's flawed.

Now that's a big mistake for our scientists to make, but just say, Dr.

The number should be smaller by a factor of 100 billion.

What is 10 to the power of 2000 divided by 100 billion, do you know?

You can't question these numbers because they are too big to be questioned.

Now, in 1 cell, if you want 100 proteins, you need 10, 000 amino acids and the 10, 000 amino acids have to be all levo, left sided links, that is all, only left sided links.

In the chromosomes, you need about 100, 000 nucleotides and in this case, you need only right-handed links.

What are the chances of getting 10, 000 amino acids left-handed and 100, 000 nucleotides right-handed in 1 and the same place to have formed that cell.

Harold Morowitz, he said, why don't we look at the whole cell?

Cell wall, cell membrane, gallbladder apparatus, mitochondria, everything.

What is the chance of bringing all those components together in the same point at the same time so it just might form a cell?

1 chance in 10 to the power of 100 billion.

1 is to 10 to the power of 50 is impossible.

And that is just to bring the stuff together.

Now somehow we've got to put life into it.

Once life comes in, each part must know what to do.

What are the chances that they'll know what to do?

What are the chances that that first cell will know exactly how to divide so that when it's divided, both are still alive?

Have you ever tried to divide something into 2 and both still alive?

Don't try it on yourself or on anybody else.

Both were alive at the end and then became more and more complex.

Plant life, animal life, and then finally human beings, and then finally not only did we have life, we began to think from where did that come?

And then we began to appreciate things like courage and beauty and love and all that.

If the list is endless, what are the chances?

If there are only 2 possibilities, like we said there were, only 2 and only 1 is correct, then if A is possible, so is B.

If A becomes improbable, B becomes probable.

Let me give you a real life, maybe a math test, but I'll make it easy for you.

Comparing the Five Great World Religions, Part 1

Okay, while we are looking, waiting for this to come back onto the screen, let's just do a quick recap of what we did this morning.

The first question was, is there a God in existence?

And we decided that the usual way to look at it is is to have 2 columns of argument.

1 mine and 1 yours, and that won't work, and so...

And so we decided to do what we had described as the pan process, in which you had 4 columns of argument because of the 2 options.

And the 2 options were there is a God in existence, there is no God in existence.

For the first option, what are the points for it, and what are the points against the other side?

And then we go to the next option, what are the points for it and what's the point against it?

And with those 4 columns, we realize that there's a very good reason, it's a reasonable decision you can make that there is something that is supernatural and by sheer logic of our own existence, and the way we apply that existence, if there is another existence beyond us, is that that cannot be just an inanimate power.

It had to be a power that has a personality, mind, heart, think, talk.

The next question we had was, are all those statements out there only relatively true?

In my book I've looked at it about 12 or 14 different ways and we looked at 3 and actually it does not stand to scrutiny, logical examination.

With that form of truth out, we went to the traditional form of truth.

And in the traditional form of truth, we found another question there.

The traditional meaning those claims that were in written codes that have come down to us.

Is it true that all of them, the different ones, Hinduism, Islam, Buddhism, Christianity, Judaism, Sikhism, Jainism, are they just different paths to the same final goal?

And when we looked at their writings themselves, none of them acknowledged that.

In fact, each of the major religions said They were the only way, and there was no question about it.

But each of them were claiming to be the only way, and so we looked at the options.

I couldn't say that because I didn't know what was right.

Somewhere out there, among the many claims that we have out there, is 1 claim that is legitimately correct when it says it is the only way.

So we decided to look for that with these 5 major religions, Hinduism, Islam, Buddhism, Christianity, Judaism.

I just put it there as an example of an author.

We will be going through Now a little more rapidly because we need to complete this by tomorrow.

So you can take notes like I said, and that's good.

But if ever you kind of sit back and listen, that is also acceptable because over there is a book that I have authored, and that book contains everything that is on the screen.

All the arguments that I say, all the pieces of information is in that book.

Retail is 22 bucks, but for this seminar it'll be $15 each.

Let's carry on with the 10 questions that we said.

Before we go to those 10 questions, there were something that I looked at, unique factors.

Now, each of these claims said, this is a unique factor.

It's so unique that it will really sway you into thinking the way I think.

But when I looked at the other religions, they also had similar claims.

So I wrote them down as so-called unique factors.

Now that doesn't mean they're unimportant, they're just non-unique, alright?

We'll lay them aside because if they are not unique, it won't help me find the only way.

A complete message, faith and trust, picture of a savior God, incarnation, that means God becoming man, there's 1 supreme being, It is revelation and not man-made.

The ideas in the religion are beyond logic and reason.

Realization and experience are the essential keys.

The blessings are present even in this present life.

It's not just for the adherence of that religion.

The first 3 questions are to the writings.

Folklore, there's no attempt to state a real true story.

The main intent is to be interesting and bring out a lesson in morals.

So you can read these folk tales which say that, you know, the trees were whispering and the sun was shining and all the birds and the bees got together for a big committee meeting.

But they are stating it just to make a lesson on a moral.

Because it's the credibility that's in question.

If it is a folk tale, then the story itself you know is not true.

Now how do I know whether the message is true?

If it is legendary or mythological, same question.

Whereas if it is historical, that means if the person really wrote down a real story, then the chances are that what is attached to the story, meaning the lessons and the doctrines that are attached to the story, have that much higher credibility.

So, first is a folk tale, second is a legend.

It's probably based on a real or true story, but then changes crept in, exaggerations, embellishments, and the changes begin generations after the event.

The changes begin generations after the event when eyewitnesses are no longer alive to challenge that change.

There are legends that we already know about.

Long ago there was somebody known as Saint Nicholas and he did help young boys and girls.

But after a little while he helped so many, like hundreds and then thousands.

And then how did he visit all those thousands?

He couldn't walk, so he had to have some form of conveyance.

But then a sled going on ice, well, it can't go around the world all that way, so it had to fly in the air, you know?

And then, of course, you had the reindeer also that could fly in the air.

And then what's the use of having just a, you know, a mundane bunch of reindeer?

So we have Rudolph the Red-Nosed Reindeer.

The fact is there was a story long ago, but changes came in, and changes came in generations after the event.

And the time period for a legend is usually centuries.

I'll give you a real life example for those of you who are Americans here.

How many of you will agree with me if I told you Abraham Lincoln was 5 foot 4 and 310 pounds?

Comparing the Five Great World Religions, Part 2

I took 6 minutes extra, and I gave back only 2.

I'm cheating, but I think we'll go ahead and start.

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Series

Subodh Pandit: Come Search with Me, Let's Look for God

Just One Way?

Transcript

Parent Series

Parent Conference

Sponsor

Recorded

Parts

The Existence of God

1h

Just One Way?

59m

Comparing the Five Great World Religions, Part 1

1h

Comparing the Five Great World Religions, Part 2

57m

Comparing the Five Great World Religions, Part 3

1h

The Man, The Book, The Supreme Transaction

1h

Sound Doctrine