MTYC 2010: You Are My Witnesses

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Montana Youth Conference

MTYC 2010 Breakout Seminar - Music

Marion Peppers

God’s Original Song

All right, I am going to be talking, of course, about music, but not just, I'm not going to be teaching you how to sing or how to read music.

I'm going to be talking about biblical principles of music.

What does the Bible, the spirit of prophecy, have to say about music?

I know that this has been a subject that's been really confusing to me in the past.

And I know some of you said that you've heard music seminars before already, so some of this may be review.

But hopefully we can gain a blessing from this.

So I'm gonna have to be moving back and forth here.

But I just wanted to start with a word of prayer before we get started.

Dear Heavenly Father, Lord, we thank you so much for this day and for this chance to be here at the Montana youth conference.

Lord, we know that we are going to receive a blessing today and throughout this weekend, and I just pray now that your Holy Spirit would be in this room, and that nothing I say would glorify me, but it would only glorify you, Lord.

Help your name to be uplifted, and help us to learn something new about music and what you have in mind for us regarding this issue.

We thank you so much and we love you in Jesus' name, amen.

Alright, so I'm going to be, first of all I want to let you know if any of you have any questions about music in general or about anything that I have to say, I have a little bowl in the back with some papers, some pens that you can write down.

The last class that I'm going to be doing is for questions and answers, and also I have some already that I've been asked before.

I did this class in Ukraine several months ago.

We have an AAFCO class there that's just started, and so I was able to share there.

It was a little different because I had to use a translator, so I had to actually extend my material, because when you use a translator, of course, that cuts out half of your time.

So I had to combine some different classes and things to do this.

But I want to start off by sharing a little bit about my experience, I guess, with music and my struggles, my testimony, and where I got started in music ministry.

You know, 1 of the things that I want to mention before I get started is that music can be a very, very sensitive issue with people.

And I don't know what your backgrounds are with music or what your experiences are.

But I know, with me anyways, I've been to a lot of music seminars.

And I fought the things that I heard for a really long time.

Because music is not like a lot of other topics.

And so it touches our hearts in a way that a lot of other things don't.

And so some things are a little bit sensitive.

Sometimes when I present this seminar, I step on a lot of toes.

I know in Ukraine I had an Adventist pastor arguing with me about some of the things that I said.

That was interesting, but it was good for me because it gave me the opportunity to really study and to know what I believe to be true, and to be able to defend what I believed about that.

But I want you to know that I'm not going to be presenting anything that I haven't already struggled with.

So, you know, a lot of times you go to these places and there may be young people that say, you know, this person doesn't really understand what I'm going through.

They don't understand the struggles that I have with music, but I understand because I've been there not too long ago actually.

And so I'm not up here to shove agendas or my opinions about this topic.

I pray that I can have a balanced view on this.

I've been to a lot of seminars that weren't necessarily balanced.

They were a lot of science and facts and things just forced down your throat, and that's not what I want to do.

I just want to present what I've learned from the Bible, the spirit of prophecy, the principles that I believe that God gives us on the issue of music.

You know when I was first asked to do this seminar for the first time.

And I've always done everything that I can to stay away from that.

So when they asked me to do this, I remember I was complaining to my husband so desperately as I really don't want to do this.

Just give me a microphone and let me sing and I'll be happy.

And he told me, he said, you know, somebody wants you to do this, and I don't believe it's the person that asked you.

I believe God is the 1 that wants you to do this.

And so I remember I got down on my knees and I prayed and I said, Lord, if this is really what you want me to do, you're going to have to give me a big sign because I don't want to do this.

And it was in just a few days I got a phone call from somebody else asking me to present the same seminar.

The funny thing is that I had never done a seminar like this before, nor had I told anyone that I wanted to.

So within a week now I have 2 people asking me to do this.

And the first time was when I went to Ukraine and shared it there with the students.

It ended up being a really big blessing, not just for them, but for me.

And so as uncomfortable as some of the things may be for me to say, I believe that God placed me up here.

And just like he drug Jonah and he put him on the boat where he was supposed to, or took him off the boat and put him where he was supposed to go.

I believe that is what God is doing with me.

So I want to share from my heart what I've learned, some of my struggles, and what I believe God has for us with the issue of music.

I'm going to be actually sharing a lot of things from Pastor Ivor Meyer's presentation.

Some of you may have heard it, Sonic Warfare.

By his permission, I actually talked to him and asked him if I could use some of his material because out of all the seminars that I went to, some of which were really helpful.

His actually was the most helpful for me at the time in my life.

And I think the reason for it was that he didn't just present a bunch of facts, but he presented something that was biblical.

And it was from the viewpoint of this has something to do with my relationship with God and So it involved the heart too.

And you know that's really what I want to emphasize is We can talk about music all day long and we can share all the facts of what's good and what's bad.

But if we don't see how it relates to our relationship with God, then it's never really going to change.

We may say, okay, this music is not the best, and we may put it away for a while.

But if it hasn't changed our hearts, and if we haven't seen how it affects our relationship with God, then it's not gonna stick.

And so that's what I want to really emphasize.

I wanna share a little bit about my testimony, some pictures for you guys.

Me singing, doing what I love best, Wes and I, and those are my parents on the right.

You know, you may be wondering what qualifies me to stand up here and talk about this.

And you know I've asked myself that question sometimes.

I don't have a degree in music, I'll just tell you that.

I haven't studied for years and years on this issue, but what I can tell you is that I'm a musician, I'm a singer, I love singing, I love ministry through music and I can speak from personal experience because I've struggled, I've gone and I've studied it for myself.

And so what I can share with you is what I've learned through my own studies.

I've learned that God doesn't always call the qualified.

So he calls us first and we say, God, I can't do this.

And then God says, don't you worry about that.

But I want to tell you a little bit about where I come from.

Satan’s Counterfeit Song

Dear God, thank you for your love and thank you for music.

And we pray now that you would be with us as we discuss the devil's counterfeit for music and just pray that you would guard our hearts from those things and that we would continue to fill our minds with things from above.

Okay, so last class we talked about God's original plan for music.

But now we wanna discover the devil's counterfeit plan for music.

Because for everything good that God has, the devil has a counterfeit.

We see that in everything, in prophecy, in doctrines and truths that God has, the devil always has his counterfeit.

So why would it be any different with music?

We saw that for everything good God has, there's something bad out there for us.

So we want to look into this a little bit more in this class, but I want to ask the question first, simple question, Can the devil deceive us on the issue of music?

Alright, Mark 13, 22 is where we're going to start today.

And it says, for false Christ and false prophets shall rise and shall show signs and wonders to deceive, if it were possible, even the elect.

We're very familiar with this passage, right?

But we don't often think of it in the context of music.

If the devil can deceive us, do you think that he's gonna leave something as important to God as music?

He wants to deceive us on this issue and the Bible says that if it were possible even the elect would be deceived.

We learn how important music is to God so logically Satan's going to try and twist it and confuse us on this issue.

He doesn't want us to do anything that's gonna please God, right?

He wants the exact opposite of pleasing God.

So we're gonna see that music began in heaven, continued in the Garden of Eden with Adam and Eve.

I'm going to read this quote to you from the story of Redemption, page 31.

So the angels united with Adam and Eve in holy strains of harmonious music.

And as their songs peeled forth from blissful Eden, Satan heard the sound of their strains of joyful adoration to the Father and the Son.

And as Satan heard it, his envy, hatred, and malignity increased.

And he expressed his anxiety to his followers to incite them, Adam and Eve, to disobedience, and at once bring down the wrath of God upon them, and change their songs of praise to hatred and curses to their maker." I read this quote and it really hit me because what it's saying is that the devil was listening to Adam and Eve and the angels singing together in the Garden of Eden and it made him very, very angry.

It upset him so desperately to hear them singing those praises to God, that he decided in his mind right then and there that he was going to do everything he could to take those songs of rejoicing, those songs of praise, and turn them into songs of cursing.

And so he has been trying to do that ever since.

Satan hates to hear us sing praises to God and he's been trying to get us to sing curses instead to God.

You know, I think about this and The question that comes to my mind is, is the devil gonna be obvious about it?

Because we know when Satan deceives us, it's not an outright lie, is it?

Usually he's very sneaky and subtle and deceptive.

So he wants us to sing curses, but do you think he's gonna make it in such a way to where we know we're singing curses?

Maybe some people, but for the majority of people, for God's people, Satan is going to try and deceive us in such a way where we sing curses to God and we don't even know it.

And so we're gonna talk about that a little bit.

You know, Satan is an expert on the issue of music.

Says in Spirit of Prophecy Volume 1 that Lucifer led the heavenly choir.

We're also told that he was an exceptional musician.

You know, we do good just to sing 1 or 2 parts, not at once, 1 at a time, but it says he could sing all 4 parts at 1 time.

Satan has made a counterfeit form of music so that we will sing curses to God instead of praises.

And I want to start off by talking about something that may seem a little obvious to us.

And I want to talk about secular music a little bit.

Because for me, even though I say it may be obvious, for me, a long time, it was not so obvious.

As I said, I listen to anything and everything, and for a long time I didn't feel guilty about it.

I didn't think there was anything wrong with it.

So I want to spend some time talking about this and the dangers of lyrics and secular music before I actually get into the music part of a song.

The first, this first point, as I said, is probably a little obvious to you, but I think that it needs to be covered or it needs to be addressed.

So let's start off by reading a familiar text together, Philippians 4.8.

Finally, brethren, whatsoever things are true, whatsoever things are honest, whatsoever things are just, whatsoever things are pure, whatsoever things are lovely, whatsoever things are of good report, If there be any virtue and if there be any praise, think on these things.

We've heard this verse and we repeat it and we go over it over and over again, but at times we make it very difficult for ourselves.

This verse, it tells us what things to think on, right?

So then the opposite would be true, that we need to logically think that if the things we're listening to, things we're watching, entertainment that we are being involved in.

If they do not follow these principles, then we need to stay away from them, right?

So if the music you're listening to doesn't follow the principles in Philippians 4, 8, then there's a very obvious thing to say here.

It is hurting your relationship with God.

And that's what I didn't realize for a long time.

I thought, it doesn't have anything to do with my relationship with God.

But if the music you're listening to doesn't follow these principles, then it is hurting your relationship with God, just as in anything else that we're doing.

Anything that's not true, lovely, of good report, these different things, whether it be music, TV, entertainment, we need to get rid of it because it's hurting that relationship with God.

And so we're actually putting a barrier between us and a holy God.

And when I realized that, it changed my outlook on everything regarding music.

So no doubt about it, there's some pretty awful music out there, right?

I mean, there's music that talks about adultery, and I mean, there's music that talks about drugs and murder and all those terrible things, and we would not even think twice about listening to that stuff, right?

We're not gonna listen to that, we're Christians.

You know, those love songs or those country songs that talk about breaking up with the person you're with, go find somebody better, he's going to fulfill every desire in your heart, or are those songs that talk about, I lost this and I lost that and I lost everybody and everything, and you know, those things seem funny and innocent, but when you look at them in light of Philippians 4, 8, Are those lyrics really drawing you closer to God?

Or is it kind of like what I was experiencing, where I'm listening to songs just to make me feel a certain way or depressing songs that aren't really drawing me closer to God?

So Ask yourself the question, is the music I'm listening to bringing me closer to God or drawing my mind away from God?

Are the lyrics uplifting to me and to God?

And if not, then that's probably not what you need to be listening to.

It's going to poison your relationship with God faster than just about anything else.

And I can say this from personal experience.

You know, it's kind of like this roller coaster experience.

There were times when I was depressed and I did want to listen to a happy upbeat song.

Maybe the lyrics weren't the best but they were kind of peppier and so it kind of gave me a high for a little while and so I would be driving down the road and I'm trying to convince myself that I'm going to be happy and I put this, you know, secular song with these so-called happy lyrics, and I'm listening, and I feel better for a while, but then what happens when I get home and the music's over?

So you listen to music to make you feel a certain way, and it gives you this certain high, but then when you face reality again and you still haven't surrendered that to God, you crash again.

And so it's this constant, it's just like anything else.

Worship in Song

All right, let's start with a word of prayer.

Dear Heavenly Father, Lord, thank you for the beautiful weather outside and for bringing us back here again safely.

Lord, we pray that you would be with us through this day.

We know some of us are tired, so we pray for energy and that you would just give us understanding now as we talk about this important subject once again.

All right, so we kind of stopped in the middle of a class yesterday.

So I'm just gonna start off where we left off.

And remember last time we talked about the divine order in music.

We had melody, the harmony, and the rhythm.

And we saw how God's plan for us in music is that the rhythm would be the least important part of the song.

That the rhythm is still important, but that it should have its proper place.

And I wanted to start talking now about the difference between the popular drums that are played today in most types of music, and versus some of the percussion instruments that were used in the Bible, because that's 1 of the biggest things that people will use to argue or defend their beliefs in music is, well, you know, there was percussion in the Bible, so it's okay.

The popular drum set that's used today is called the trap set.

You have the different parts on the drum and you have the thing with your little foot and you have the cymbals and then you have the drums and yeah, right.

So you have all these different parts to the trap set.

So we want to see what the difference is between a trap set and other types of percussion instruments.

We saw how dangerous rhythm can be if it is the dominant part of a song but now we want to look also how is it played that makes it dangerous for us in a lot of the popular music.

So in most popular music today, as I said, the drum of choice is the trap set, which any drummer will tell you is a very specific and distinct type of drum.

It's very different than any other type of percussion instrument that's out there.

As I said yesterday, this specific type of drum didn't even exist in the Bible, so we really can't put the 2 side by side.

We have to look at them separately and see what they were like.

The trap set and other percussion instruments, as we're going to read some quotes here in a minute, are actually from 2 very separate families.

So I want to read a couple of quotes here.

This 1 says, let us put a little difference between the percussionist and the drummer.

These 2 have been sharing the same room for a very long time.

They may be cousins, but still keep in mind that they are from 2 very different families.

These are drummers that have written books about this.

The second quote says, there is a difference between drummers and percussionists.

A drummer usually plays a drum or drums, whereas a percussionist not only plays drums but is also skilled in the playing of a wide range of percussion instruments.

In a classical orchestra, you see we have the little triangle and the cymbals and you have all these different things that they play.

And last but not least, we have the trap set used to refer to a collection of drums and percussion accessories including cymbals.

So in other words you have basically 3 different categories here.

You have your drummers which you have your big bass drum and those types and then you have your percussionist and they play all those different things that I don't know all the names to, but I can recognize them in the orchestra.

And then you have the trap set, which is basically taking a combination of a lot of those different types of percussion instruments and putting them together in 1 instrument.

So here coming from the mouth of drummers, we see that the trap set is a very unique instrument that was designed to specifically play rock and roll.

This comes from the book, Drums, Rock and Worship, You guys have probably heard or seen that book.

He says, I've never heard of a recording of a modern trap set being used to play anything other than a hybrid of rock or jazz.

Even when the trap set is used to accompany an orchestra, the music is no longer associated with the classical type music.

Instead, it has been transformed into a rock or jazz hybrid.

You have an orchestra, You have all these different percussion instruments.

And have you guys been to like a symphony or an orchestra before?

So you have these percussion instruments that they may be playing in the song, but it's still very much a classical type piece of music.

But I've also been to orchestras where they try and make things a little bit more modern or they have 1 song that's a little bit more modern and they actually bring a trap set in and they play this type of drum.

Does the song sound the same when they play that instrument?

No, it completely changes the sound of the song.

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MTYC 2010 Breakout Seminar - Music

Making Music Practical

Transcript

Parent Series

Parent Conference

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MTYC 2010 Breakout Seminar - Music

What do YOU want to know about Godly music?

43m

The Heavenly Sanctuary and the Universal Characteristics of Worship and Music

1h 1m

Music in Your Sphere: Max the Potential of Music in Ministry

5. When the Notes Clash

1h 3m

Music in Your Sphere: Max the Potential of Music in Ministry

2. The Power of One Song

1h

The Power of Unity: Reflecting Christ in Every Relationship

01 Unity in Diversity, Part 01

53m

In Harmony With God?- Music Overview

1h 10m

Karl Tsatalbasidis ~ The 'Rock' and Worship: Music and Worship at the End of Time

Watch and Pray, or Dance and Play?

1h

Talking Points 1st Quarter 2024: Psalms

12 Worship That Never Ends

28m

Revelation Made Simple

18. Revelations Spiritual Revolution for a New Millennium

57m

Sound Doctrine