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Panel Discussion: The Ministry of Healing

Raja Tooma Wes Youngberg Mary Ann McNeilus Chester Clark Jr. Allen Lloyd

Loma Linda Dental and Medical Student Chapter Conference


  • April 11, 2009
    10:00 AM
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introduction via e-mail student chapter has been trying to say get a better grasp on the blueprint of the health message and medical evangelism and so we decided to open up the book the ministry of healing insert setting and so we have come across questions and without that's a big opportunity with the biggest presenters to happen to have a question-and-answer session so will be having a panel discussion with some questions regarding the ministry of healing we have a few questions prepared and then will follow with the same questions from from you as well if you have some questions so if you did the please come and have a seat here okay thank you for being line through share with us your thoughts we have a few questions and I guess we'll start with the question what is the role of education in the ministry of healing what is the role of education and Ministry of healing doctors is some doubt as to what I need to do some introductions here this is Doctor Wes Youngberg Doctor Marianne McNeel S Doctor Neil Leslie Doctor Roger Tuma and Doctor Chester Clark and for more bile information concerning your program at some point but them that you would like to comment on it and I think you for those of us who were here last night Doctor Natalie gave a great overview on especially from Matthew nine right before Matthew Chandler were being called out the twelve disciples are being called out how we learn what the trifecta purpose of Christ's ministry was which is the model for us and that begins with teaching that begins with education so also does a great challenge for offices that is that we have the proper education so that we can effectively improperly educate other people so so that's the beginning that goes on into proclaiming the good news which is the preaching and then and then culminates with really healing making a difference in people 's lives there's seeking their desiring healing they don't understand that healing has to be holistic in order to make a lasting difference and that's where the proper education comes in there is a chapter in the book ministry of healing entitled teaching and healing and that chapter actually encompasses our work as physicians and dentists very well in fact the word physician itself means teacher it doesn't really mean healer per se but that's how it's interpreted in today's lingo but that chapter puts the two together education in healing and railway in order to change anyone's life you know the stages of change when you look at the psychological stages of change the first stage him and lay terms is to be what's trying to think of the unthinking of the the nonlife terms of the life terms this is to be incompetent and to be unaware that you are incompetent and so in order to progress to the stages of change you have to actually become consciously incompetent and it in order to move you from unconsciously incompetent to consciously incompetent you have to have education you have to have true knowledge and true knowledge is indeed do you the final pathway it's very opening pathway and then it really encompasses the spiritual component beyond that to be able to apply that knowledge so that you become a consciously competent and then the final stages to become unconsciously competent words not an something you're struggling with anymore you have complete victory can you please comment on the following quotes this is taken from character personality page fifty nine and it reads sickness of the minds prevailed everywhere nine tenths of the diseases for which men suffer have their foundation so can you please comment on the following quote Charlie Mayo founder of one of the cofounders of the Mayo Clinic was pretty close to saying the same thing he said eighty percent of the patients that we see have the origin of their dynamic in their mind turning the yell back at the time she said that it was pretty seemingly far-fetched and not simply because you know asthma headaches those types of things were thought to be physical ailments and we now know that they're much more likely to result from depression anxiety in fact if you take a look at the scientific studies showing what depression increases in regards to physical ailments it's pretty astounding and so the achievement correctly pointed out that many of the diseases of which men suffer actually have their origin in the mind when you take a look at this tobacco and alcohol you know we think while at the physical problem him physical addiction but these people that are consuming at odd to their own adverse health know that it's bad for them but they can't give it up where's the problem the problem is the mind and as you know so far as to where Mary Baker Eddie was a Merry Baker Eddy said one hundred percent of diseases from which men suffer have their origin in the mind that she had a balance there she did leave that room there but if you take a look at what we see in the hospital basis day after day in a clinic basis the struggles on it were dealing with our mental struggles and when we get that mind in better shape than we have a lot better chance of getting the Osmond headaches and the other problems I taken care like this in the least with respect to the balance that Ellen White brings to the ministry dealing in all writings there's there's many people who are actually illiterate in the writings of Ellen White would have many opinions about her in her writings and and they frequently talk about how either legalistic or out of balance she is erotic touch with wit which was really scientific and yet I is a quote that I want to read to you briefly from that page two hundred forty one of the ministry of healing that really sums up this question she says the relationship that exists between the mind and the body 's very intimate when one is affected the other sympathizes condition of the mind affects the health of far greater degree than many realize many of the diseases from which men suffer other result of mental depression again she doesn't say all she says many great anxiety discontent remorse guilt distrusts all tend to break down the life forces and to invite decay and that disease is sometimes produced and is often greatly aggravated by the imagination so once again the question of balancing she says some times it is the main cause but oftentimes is a contributing cause and therefore should always be considered in the treatment of the sick in the treatment of those her design healing of various cause it's also a great statement from the ministry of healing that I think we can all take and use effectively in our ministry document 's comment reminded me of a case Jim is in my chair just this week in fact he is very quickly informed me that he quit smoking recently and I said who were wonderful what did you do because I was talking to people about younger nicotine flashing things they can do to help them you know when they decide he said I just I just decided to quit so the mind is more powerful than we give it credit for thinking of them another quotes from the ministry of healing page two twenty seven and it reads in the word of God we have instruction relative to special prayer for the recovery of the sick but the offering of such prayer is a most solemn act and should not be entered upon without careful consideration in many cases of prayer for the healing of the sick that which is called faith is nothing less than presumption so the question is how do we reconcile the prayer of faith with the prayer of presumption having faith means to tell trust income to its attorneys in his will and how it translates to healing the sick and presumption okay I would like to address how God as God is sitting up there in a vantage point him the president asked the future we do not we now live in LA and even the present and future he knows things I know of every person he knows what there am the person is healed how that is nice I didn't follow the loss he knows all so when we pray the prayer of faith has to be the Lord he took questions you will please heal if it's okay with you if not that you will begin to know everything and I can relate to what happened to me ninety one was thrown outside horses back in housing fifteen hundred days of a doctor if your number and University they thought I done said I stopped stopped beating the value is big but I surprised and the following days i.e. with without the ventilator no idea how to let them realize for three months but he told me the Lord came back and I can say will I I maybe I say may be the Lord kept me of always it when everybody pray for me because maybe he knew how my life would be returning to the beginning it was always very much away from the Lord even after the accident and he brought to life and I went even farther into the world only my conversion and praise his name and my breath everybody agrees is for him might like it he's after thinking me he is my life Keith he is the love of my life I want to talk about it to every person and so on when when they pray they did not know this but it was according maybe determined I'm unlikely that way am I assuring and stirring thank you one definition that I have found from thoughts from the mount of blessing page one forty six any belief or a belief that does not lead to obedience is presumption any belief that Medici away from obedience to following God 's laws whether they be physical realm or mental or spiritual is presumption and one of the statements from medical ministry page thirteen and fourteen and I will quote it to you when prayer for healing is presumption is so forward-looking act here when we do all we can on our part to have help then may we expect that the priest blessed results will follow and we can ask God in faith to bless our efforts for the preservation of health and it follows those who will gratify their appetite and then suffer because of their intemperance and then take drugs to relieve them may be assured that God will not interpose to save health and life which are sold recklessly parent when I was in eighth grade I again the passion for the medical ministry work I started reading the book ministry of healing and I I fell in love with Jesus all over again by understanding what our mission really is not only the church but but to meet the needs of the world that are currently not Matt and as I him here as I was reading through the book and contemplating how should impact my life personally but also how it would impact my life in the future one of our family friends develop cancer she was a mother of of the four and I remember my parents talking about it kind of away from me and how she is she had asked for anointing and apparently some people I don't I don't know the context of how they presented this to a red encouraged her with regards to her diet and essentially she rebuffed them and and yet she was still praying for or are asking for anointing and healing I remember that dialogue around that situation and I'm sure happens every day and in in a medical setting eye and it made me think of as two aspects of this number one what would cause somebody to completely rebuff a an encouraging word or or a and approach to lifestyle that is studied objectively as if studied prayerfully is clearly divine counsel what would cause people to reject that and a partial answer to that would be potentially how the message was presented to that individual or being the developmental aspects of how that message was presented or or or or the how the message was seen as she grew up with is seen as a legalistic concept was it the right fist of the gospel as opposed to really what it should you open hand of Jesus calling COM to me and I will give you rest and I think a lot of people especially many of us who've been raised in the church it would been raised more from a legalistic perspective we oftentimes you know the ministry of healing oratory or the deed the do 's and don'ts of of Reformation or health as as the defeatist the closeness of the gospel and we rejected on that emotional basis and so that's a challenge I think for all of us is to make sure that that medical ministry is the right of the good news is this drink that that that that foreshadows it it it it brings in the good news it attracts people to the good news and it should never be otherwise and if it is otherwise we should be involved in this method message in an age when the general public puts their trust in modern medical science and technology and in physicians accurately been to put their trust in the great physician who is Jesus Christ and have the eighth affirmative trust the divine power how can we incorporate that bullies are several ways I didn't actually will easier to do that now that I think it used to be because there's so much on medical science out there in regards to the health benefits of trusting and particularly trusting in something that you actually believe in that we call it into the medical science calls the intrinsic religiosity versus extrinsic Yossi which is just going to church in order to pass your business card around them and I will be part of the social club etc. and done that his show not to be very very beneficial at all to health and so I lost them and him that my work of the patient just mention you know part of the limited part of the therapy that medical science has and shown us can be helpful I is actually trusting in divine power would you be willing as part of this visit for me to offer a prayer for you and the vast majority of time except that in their very appreciative of that and and it really lends itself to the into the spiritual discussions well it depends on what easy to talk to is like when they see your spiritual uniting to carrying all out for them you'd be increased into the visit so open and accepting thankful so many patients at the end of my praying within the holding fixture like these kids to vote for me you I like to leave into my discussion with patients in every way from the time they initially asking how are you and I say I'm blessed to live you know when I'm dismissing them that's I'm also trying to remind them constantly of our Creator and the fact that God has created us with better world structures then we can develop ourselves the man has devised and so a you know in subtle ways I like to try to to remind them that we are creatures create preachers and we serve a powerful God that knows better than we do and when people coming in come in thinking sure they want dentures for instance you know I don't that's the context that I put it in the you know you have better than any man can make make that then at least fantasy true medical missionary work is one of the greatest ways for people to see that there is a God I work a lot with people who do not have Christianity as their main religion I work with Buddhists have worked with Muslims I work with Amish I work with others on the homage do they have their own or dancing see the how to see God is a carrying person find them is a hands on experience and that's why God gave us the hydrotherapy and the simple herbs and massage and simple treatments that we put our hands on in our modern medical setting we don't do that we leave it to the nurses to the specialist but I want all of us to do this even those who retrain a medical missionary work or not physicians are not doctors dentists God wants us all to have that hands-on expense because the next taste and see experience and see that the Lord is good that is the most powerful ways to meet them even more than verbal prayer which really opens it to him him is a difference having practiced on both sides of that fence I can say the hands-on greatly increases a person 's desire to know that he'd seen it over and over and over again make sure many of you have questions so at this time if you read the razor hand involves secretory microsphere this is an earlier summit he mentioned that smoking habit can be best checked by thinking about it using your mind for some people do you find that time using the prescribed remedies Nicorette gum etc. is a is a reasonable alternative I know that John assessment was that it is a question which you if you were an intern had just graduated medical school in your upper-level resident asked you to prescribe Nicorette gum for a patient of yours that was admitted to the hospital that Tom couldn't smoke all are in the hospital that they started to crave nicotine what would your answer be to them anybody on a method that's a question that is a very practical one because I thought it comes up all the time every hospital in America now is a non-smoking Sony and so when they enter that hospital today really can't smoke him of course they can start suffering all the withdrawal symptoms about and it's best to have that discussion with them when you're working them up in regards to I know where they're at in the process if they are not in the process where they're not going to take this as an opportunity to equip themselves and they have no desire to quit I'm not trying to relieve is much of their withdrawal suffering as possible temporarily by such measures can be helpful and helpful to nurses etc. and and so that's when we went when we would utilize that I however it's also very clear on the the top addiction allergists and emanation many of them are agnostic or atheist but they will stay very accurately there is nothing that I can give you are prescribed to you it will get you over this addiction and also say very clearly because the evidence is there if you want to get over this addiction you have to see the spiritual people over there I don't know what they do that's where you get success and so the spiritual aspect of overcoming addiction is very much there and I believe anyone who is under the addictive power of anything will never recover from it unless they have the influence of the Spirit of God in their life now that's not to say that we wouldn't utilize you know that another measure etc. to help you with an individual who is struggling but those measures are in the miniscule in comparison to the the measure of the great physician the spiritual aspect the road the real question that we need to consider general smoking cessation is is providing for that patient what they really need to remove that this ease that drives the smoke I sold the worst showing the busy medical setting the simple thing to do is prescribe something that provides a chemical answer a few well a chemical solution if you will to to help her help minimize that this ease but that's not addressing the real problem is the real problem is all the other things in their lives and their lifestyle under thinking pattern that are generating that disease and so we need to go to the axle caused the problem that's one of the beauties of the ministry of healing and and as we so frequently here they now for remedies looking at the natural remedies asked his staff remedies to help ease the disc eased that people have that lead them to all the negative behaviors onto smoking by all the potentially negative behaviors and so so this becomes a basis of foundation five which we help individuals improve their lives and their health Raleigh holistically not just for this one condition because even if you find a solution to that one condition you're still not addressing the larger issue of the dysfunction in their lives and so as so no matter what you do we need to go to the foundation for and there may need there may be times that we need to have access to God but unfortunately in modern medicine the absence or usually within the adjuncts are being the natural remedies are perceived as at if we have time to course rarely occurs in insult so that's I think this set if this is discussed early on in the process if this setting if the hospital itself the clinic itself allows for addressing these other opportunities for them to find real you that addresses the cost another question in front I seems to me that about every two years on average some like there is oftentimes sought your homeland a medical student who inserted his in a position of sort of a conflict of conscience in terms of their understanding of what they have to do in terms is typically in regards to Sabbath observance in a training maybe cross gender treatments on sleep deprivation on our own something else as I have seen these situations play out they can be in pretty tough situations for the students go through just to struggle with this issue and you know today's forgive incident to the perceived requirements of the education after they take a stand and if so you know will you have the ministration of look at this party any suggestions on for the student who finds himself in a situation as to how they might be tortured in well-established Sarah one of the hallmarks of our messages out mathematics religious liberty and it's really one of the hallmarks are messages of the Bible as well and how do we deal with with issues of conscience and when there are our strengths in regards to the conscience and I think it's important to him to know when it am very similar ways to have right Bible characters deal with it I know Daniel I was under that situation in regards to diet I even and the approach that he chucks was kind courteous empathetic and so much so that the smells are true the individual as stated I welcome the Bible states because he found grace and favor that the Lord also helped out that situation so that that trial the first prospective clinical trial ever recorded in human history I came about I and him and we know what the results of that was and so I think it's very important for the student to to have that spirit of Daniel to have that love to have that empathy to make it clear that this isn't some sort of some rigid stance that they're taking the benefit themselves to take advantage of the whole group is there because often that's how it's perceived as are you just trying to get out of something when it comes to Sabbath observance like to make away even making that up in some other way and making it clear in regards to the deep desire to carry out their conscience I know there's times when I've been in situations when I was in training when I was put under that and people just don't know who don't understand the beauty of the Sabbath have a hard time understanding that that course that you're wanting to pursue in so they would ask me at times you know well I understand this is the way it is most of the time that I'm just asking you for an exception because of this or that or whatever and I would say you know you need Sam were I'm coming from him regress in this you know that taking that exception to me would also mean that I love my wife the majority of the time but undertaken exception on occasion and love another woman and in regards to my conscience and in that area it's the same when it comes to the Sabbath and they understand that point they'll look at José while I I understand him and they'll recognize the the moral stance it's been taken into that I finished high school when I was sixteen I started medical school in Iraq and medical schooling Iraqi six years and not a nineteenth here and then we went to school and students went to school sixty seven meeting some of his daily school it was loud and was lectures and so I missed everything about this young age to go to the professors and think and him and Cindy Anthony and I cannot come to school on today is it okay if I could become the lab with another group that it was difficult I suck cock like a sore from amongst all this is not new this is the Sabbath keeping things at is a Muslim country in the act it was very weird but on the professors when they saw that I'm speaking in confidence and say they actually helped me I was able to make a class selectors so it's really home page to be faithful take one more question from the company this by bringing a microphone for the questionnaire the cue ball and then you have to go to the person to cross him he is the and around are incomplete as there's got to flow well round our list is less it says in the Bible Jacob lead and zinc here's one of the plot about time I would look for excuses to report those that home in minutes of those and humbly sought to talk peace in the midst of trial were given the judicial system she's hot so getting back to this main idea you need someone across the bridge to transform the nation of the mother thought that I will leave it at that to get you results because in the multitude counselor there was a Pharisee Romans twelve to where where we are told about transformation sister do not conform any longer to the pattern of this world but be transformed by what the renewing of your mind and so we need to the open-minded and we need to be willing to submit to where the true glory lies and I this is where education comes in his educating individuals about the UV cause effect relationships of just following the world was going to happen if we just continue to do what everybody else is what everybody else seems to think is okay and how transformation can can can totally change that for us so so that I would just drop into that Scripture reference and I like to use in the matter was Saturday night I speak to patients or or or secular groups I can be of help his transformation in the very best page statement that transcends cultural that transcends physiology that is spiritual and psychological is this global from the apostle Paul that that we need to we need to put away the ways of the world and be allowed to open our mind to truth so I think that's how we lead people in the right direction and if we use the help message there is already trying to that truth and if they start seeing the is that I don't medicine for instance then you can draw them to the creator because now it may have you have one confidence in one person will will that is actually a key question because what is transformation its character didn't sound this was why she says came to die for a widely Christian world to celebrate why is that he came to be are pattern man he came to be at risk to lead a sinless life and he has led had came and gave us the example for us to follow in order to lead someone else to character transformation we must have that evidence in our own times and we must understand our home I am at process and this is where the true medical missionary work comes in because what is character transformation it involves the mental physical and spiritual health in all areas in the notice that is true character to found as we say health by instruction is takes longer him I do therapy massage or whatever you may say may take longer drug is a quick fix a miracle is a quick fix but we are looking for quick fixes because were looking for health each friendly not just help him and if we are to be taken out of this world without seeing dad we are attributed in Indian time character transformation is extremely important and this is why I gave this this in time method of healing because he wants to take us all out just a quick comment I'm glad he used the thought of leading someone to change because we per sure cannot push anyone to change and I think of that statement in Mister Keating page one hundred this is our confession of his faithfulness is heavens chosen agency for revealing Christ we are to acknowledge his grace as made known to the holy men of old but that which will be most effectual is the testimony of our own experience that is what the consumer has found I know I've heard her speak before an effectual in her witnessing and working with patients is sharing sharing our own experience thank you all so much at this time done if you could please give a brief description of the breakout session that each of you will have this afternoon if you can introduce your industry name and a quick half minute or so lets you convert and looking at the application a truly holistic lifestyle medicine energy health evangelistic contacts six years ago my parents were religious educators retire from NG University and I began a journey of literally taking the ministry of healing and applying it holistically to help evangelism as opposed to just what we've traditionally done and looking at a natural remedies which are wonderful that you may recall that the minister healing has seven hundred higher captors on the family as DVD mind here which course is part of trusting in God that very occupies not address very effectively within the context of what we typically do in health education or in our health evangelism programs and so that this is where when wellness was was developed as a is a holistic model of the ministry of healing as I'll be talking about that this afternoon which is essential this is a program that is currently being translated into over twenty languages in the call is to really allow this to be used as a right arm of the gospel to finish the work as we know that in the ad the medical ministry work will be what the only form of ministry available to us that every church member every church should be involved in this process is so so we've been developing tools PowerPoint presentation the twenty one different presentations that focus on the more holistic approaches to healing that can be presented by you in the church setting small group settings and clinic settings and share with you how we've been doing and how you can do it as well first of all I'm extremely disappointed I'm extremely disappointed because we are having five wonderful speakers might want to attend the other for him on my cell so I don't know how you're going to make the him I can excuse myself and I I am going to be speaking about topic that I feel is a vital importance in these last days I won't spill the beans right now because I think will develop it in the class but there's a lot of healing that is going out there that is totally completely false how do we determine what is true how do we determine what is on and why it is important to our eternal life to do so and why have we been given a pattern of how to practice to completely avoid any possibility of falling into that trap my seminar comes from a also a book ministry of healing the essential knowledge and mine sure and so we will be looking at the of the mind sure approaches that are very successful and will also be showing some things from my science and I last night in my talk on a ministry of healing left out all the quotes from chapter because that's what we'll be doing with this afternoon a mile my husband and I did that I want you to come to my next session I think you got it in your heart to come only to hear the story of my conversion and how he translated him I know what he needs and as a result of what God did in my life what you want in each outlet I see I print my patients take the deadline coming him it was about twenty five years ago that the lady on the staff of we Mark college didn't need a paper that included a number of quotations that pertain to demonstrate that along with some other events that were going on in my professional practice at the time led me down a road in home biological dentistry and just to give you one example of a case that treated last summer and it realized thankfully not all of them are this severe that Jim and his wife called me up and was very anxious that I see her husband and we were too meant to schedule the next week and we we worked on one quadrant of his steed replacing his fillings and he was staying at the schools guestroom the next day came back and as we're getting ready to do another quadrant his wife sat in the room and told me that he has slept all night for the first time in many months which meant she also and that this man was in severe pain he been diagnosed with three terminal illnesses and he could just barely walk in fact he told me later was just by willpower that he got from the car into my chair and as we were beginning his wife told me that the week before he was walking through the house and he suddenly collapsed on your hand she and her daughter were there they're both nurses they found him with no heartbeat no respiration and his pupils were dilated and they somehow revived him called nine one thousand nine one one got into the hospital and spent three days in hospital and was sent home him anyway this this gentleman is is presently fully recovered his back at work as a chaplain in a wellness program and this is one of the things that helps me get up and get work in the morning in spite of the fact that some of the transition businesses that help Dennis transition into retirement say that it's very rare for someone over fifty five to want to go to work in the morning that come this afternoon and I want to challenge at least the dentist to consider const the God 's instruction in the evening that applies to demonstrate that you're showing our heads are per our father we thank you for the ministry of healing and rethinking for the ministry of Jesus Christ that we can incorporate into our future practices and our practices currently we pray Lord that as we study your word and spirit of prophecy that you will that you will teach us for your great teacher and help us Lord to answer some of the difficult questions and put them into practice we pray in Jesus name and


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