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Darwinism On Trial

Chris Holland
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Chris Holland

Chris Holland is speaker/director of It Is Written Canada. 



  • January 14, 2017
    11:30 AM
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It has stood the test of time are God's Book the Bible. Still relevant in today's complex world. It is for sure messages of all around the world. Thank you for joining it is written. You know we've had many discussions in the past about biblical origins We've discussed some scientific reasons that the biblical reason of origins is attractive that if you've missed any of those shows on origins you can go to our youtube channel W.W.W. dot youtube dot com forward slash I.W. Canada but I will tell you when you look at Origins one of the often overlooked areas of understandings in the issue of origins makes an immense practical difference in our lives and what is that issue that issue is ethics to help us in our discussion about ethics I have with me Dr Tim Standish Dr Standish thank you so much for joining us again Well I'm glad to be back you know Dr Standish you are the senior scientist of the geo science research institute you hold a bachelor's degree and zoology a master's degree in biology a Ph D. in environmental biology and that's a lot of big words. Maybe in simple Tell us what do you do Dr Standish on a daily basis by trade I'm a molecular geneticists So I'm very interested in D.N.A.. And the information that's included into that D.N.A. and how that information is retrieved and used by the cells in al bodies and in the obviously the cells that make up any other organism to actually make that that organism it's it's a profound mystery and yet we're finding out little things as we go along and every time we find out something new all of a sudden we we discover that things much more profound than we've had to subpoena so it's an exciting area of science to work in Yes Now why is it then that you're working for the geo science research institute and maybe tell us a little bit about what the geo science research institute does well the genocide its research institute is. A group of scholars we're all Ph D. scientists who are interested in the relationship between the claims of science and what is revealed in Scripture Now most of the time there is no disagreement between these things but obviously there are some areas where the where there are these kind of tensions between the current claims of science and the clear statements or clear record of scripture so we're interested in those areas of tension What do we do with them as Christians what do we do with them as scientists we kind of straddle that that divide and yeah it makes for a very interesting area sometimes the what a controversial area to work and now if someone was interested in this area wanted to do a little more reading find some resources where might they go to find more information about the geoscience Research Institute and some of the work that you've been doing well certainly a good place to start would be a website and the U.R.L. is G R I sta dot G.'s Grizz G R I S D A dot org wonderful Now you and I have had a number of discussions about origins and people can go to our website or to our You Tube channel and and see some of those discussions that invigorating discussions that we've had. One of the issues when we talk about origins and I and I talked about that in the intro is that we have not discussed is the issue of ethics so why don't we just start real baseline right there what is ethics basically ethics the principles the system of morals that we use to decide what's right and what's wrong what's righteous and what's on righteous OK so here's then the question you're a scientist I'm a pastor why are we having a discussion about ethics when it comes to the issue of origins well because our understanding of origin's makes a huge difference in decision making about what's right and what's wrong. Obviously one of the foundational things that you have to establish if you're developing a system of ethics is what is a human being because if a human being is let's say a worthless object then killing a human being would not be a bad thing at all. If a human being is an invaluable creation of God then well you know maybe human life has a different value to it than. Than you know other ways in which you can look at it so there are a lots of implications just right there and I think you've alluded to it just a little bit there but let's talk about that what are the moral implications of accepting the Biblical record of origins number one the Bible tells us that everything we see. Is ultimately created by God and this is very important also sustained by God OK God sustains his creation and so then we have to ask ourselves how should I treat this creation you should should I. Be comfortable with the idea that we can go out and destroy the environment in which we live destroy other organisms. For some short term expedient expediency for myself so so just in terms of how we treat the the the rest of the creation is a big big question prosody one that we as Christians should struggle with a little bit more think about the Bible is quite amazing you know it gives very specific instructions about how we should treat other animals it is tells us that God cares about other creatures it does not put However those other creatures on the same footing as human beings the Bible tells us that human beings difference yes we have been created in the image of God It also tells us that. There's something special then about the relationship between men and women if there's one you need difference in the Creation of human beings the don't see with the other organisms OK God formed Adam out of the dust Yes. Bible tells us in Genesis 2 that he formed all the other creatures out of the dust yes God breathed the breath of life into Adam but if we look particularly the a few chapters into into the book of Genesis where it starts talking about the flood we hear it talking about other creatures with the breath of life in them OK it is so. Wow You know what is it that makes Adam different yes it is wonder if he is formed in the image of God but think about this one about. First of all Adam got to observe the other creatures and realize his need for a wife yes the other creatures didn't get that yes and then and this is just glorious God create Eve from Adam Yes Wow yes that's different now you're a pasta I don't know you know I'm a mere biologist Yes but I notice these differences yes and that does have powerful implications the relationship between a man and a woman is not the same as the relationship between a cow and a bull yes there is a difference and so when we start talking about relationships between human beings the creation account makes a huge difference that is powerful and so when we look at the moral implications of understanding and accepting the biblical account of origins it has more than just the implication of an intellectual ideology but rather in a fax. Putting it simply how I live how I treat others because when you and I are talking when you and I are interacting you are a creature created by God When I interact in the in the environment around me this environment the plants the animals are things created by a creator that I ought to have an appreciation for oh yes it is. And in the is there is another area that I think we can dig into if we actually get into. The what I would consider to be the most popular alternative view of things yes which is Darwinian evolution you know it becomes quite stock when you stop comparing and contrasting what's what's going on there yes and I was just going to ask you about that because. Then the glaring question is if I accept something outside the biblical account of origins Darwinian evolution is the most popular Now maybe just as a kind of a brief very very very brief explanation of Darwinian evolution which will do it justice because volumes have been written what is Darwinian evolution in its simplest explanation. At its core Darwinian evolution is a materialistic theory of origins so it's a theory that says there was no intervention from outside of nature when it came to the production of all of the organisms that we see today and so kind of standing in distinction from the biblical account the bibble cow account gives a plan with a plan or or a design with a design or Darwinian evolution there is no plan there is no design there is no plan or there is no designer things just happened because that's the course of things happening in its simplicity and now Charles Darwin himself you remember he was a trained theologians Yes he was a trained pastor Yes So he's actually thought about these things sometimes quite deeply and wrote about them as well so he actually does do a fair amount of comparing and contrasting himself I've got a quote here that I want to read to you this because. Charles Darwin writing why back in 1838 OK so you remember that he published his theory of evolution in a book called The Origin of Species Yes That book was published in 1859 so 21 years before that he was writing and he wrote man in his arrogance thinks himself a great work worthy the into position of a deity more humble and I believe true to consider him created from animals Wow So Dawa and. Long long long before actually he started writing The Origin of Species this had committed himself to some kind of evolutionary idea in which human beings came from animals and by the way this was not unique to him at that particular time it wasn't even unique in his own family his grandfather Erasmus Darwin believed the same thing and actually wrote about it he had a apparently a family motto that said something like everything came from shells. Which is which is kind of interesting but it does one believed we came from animals we were not the creation of God so morally then we are the same as the other animals and so with that said then Dr Standish I mean what is the moral implications and what are the some of the moral implications Well you know I'm a mere biologist so what I try to do is I try to go and read what people who are experts in this area say OK and I have a quote here from Peter Singer Now Peter Singer is a very eminent ethicists. He is he's a Darwinian ethicist and many people have heard of him because he's been a champion of animal rights OK. And that obviously springs from his kind of system of ethics human beings. Not necessarily different from animals yes so why would we treat humans differently than we treat animals so let me let me read this to you he said if our substance and our structure is the same as that of other animals if we are an animal rather than a specially created being made in the image of God hell can this not reduce the gulf between us and them he used the Adam a lesson humans have the sane no moral status and he's not alone in doing that James Rachael's another prominent commentator in this area wrote an evolutionary perspective denies that humans are different in kind from other animals and one cannot reasonably make distinctions in morals when none exist in fact so you know this is not I don't want to put words into these journalists Mel sure but this is very very profound because if humans are the same as animals then either animals have all the same rights as human beings or human beings have no special rights at all. Yes And I mean and beyond that it would it would seem that not only. We talk about the operation of society and society is governed by laws and regulations and many of those laws and regulations it least in the United States and in Canada many of those laws and regulations actually find their roots in the Bible but if we're saying that I mean the implications of this are far reaching that not only do animals in and human beings have the same rights so to speak but then as human beings we really don't need to operate within a set of laws or regulations because if we're no different than animals then we should just do as we desire that's right if it's OK for animals must be OK for human beings as well now there are a number of areas with this is actually coming to quite says Doc focus in the last few years one of them has to do with. The question of human rights yes in this system of thinking human rights don't really actually kind of exist because why would we have different rights than than other organisms OK so how do you justify them treating human beings differently than cows or frogs or trees or. What what is developing is a system that it's a utilitarian way of thinking about things basically the argument is humans are special because we have special called Natu the abilities OK We have special brains and Kells don't so callous can't comprehend suffering let's say in the same way that he him and beings can. And we have no real way of knowing that but this is sort of the way the thinking is so that sounds like it might work but what happens when you turn that on its Yeah a little bit what happens if you have a human being who is mentally impaired in some way what what these guys have done is they've separated the concept of a human being which is reasonably easy to identify if it comes out of a mouth a human mother it's a human being yes from a concept they call personhood or something along those lies a person may have special rights but a human does not and then the argument goes if if a person if it when a human is born they you know they're a baby they don't have the cognitive abilities of a 20 or 30 of 50 year old so therefore they don't have special rights and in fact it has been advocated even in major. At least I'm think of one specific example in a major journal of medical ethics it's been advocated that it's OK to kill babies if they're an inconvenience. Because they have no special moral status they have not yet developed into persons and of course the concept of a person is something that. Is decided by the person who decides that yes it's there's no kind of shop line that what happens when a person develops Ulzheimer as disease are they still a person anymore or is a K. to dispose of them these are questions that are being seriously Sgt. Reasoning for all. The Darwinian perspective yes and I just wanted to be clear is there it may be a viewer has picked up our show in the middle we are not advocating this we are talking about the implications is of accepting Darwinian evolution and the ethics of that is that essentially we take human beings and human beings are not special number one but number 2 even within human beings we are making a distinction that someone with cognitive abilities is a person and so very have special rights but a human being by nature doesn't have special rights so someone there are as human there are no human rights so someone that is mentally handicapped in some way someone who is possibly malformed someone who develops awls Heimer later in life they're not a person and because they're not a person with whatever cognitive abilities the individual testing cognitive abilities says is a cognitive person they're not a person and have 0 rights. Now contrast that with the biblical view of things yes and obviously we can talk in sort of abstract terms about being created in the image of God and all of those things but as Christians Bible believing Christians we have a huge advantage because the creator of this world came down. And lived as a human being yes Jesus Christ yes so we could look at how she's. Valued those who were considered to be of less value in in the society that he operated in yeah I mean I mean and Dr Standish if you got my mind just law I mean I think about Jesus I mean Jesus addresses the lapper Jesus addresses the crippled man Jesus addresses a woman who has an issue of blood and then even beyond that Jesus addresses someone who's dead and so and so the implications of that are far reaching He has the demoniac think about that yes Jesus went across the Sea of Galilee to meet men who had lost their minds and he restored them here's another one and this is this this really touches my heart yes Jesus when people bought their children to him How did his disciples react they didn't think that the children will be that's right they didn't because they are better off or worse with thinking along similar lines. But Jesus said Suffer the little children yet how Munda me he didn't say well when they're old enough and they have the cognitive abilities that make them persons then I will take care of them he you know was was there and ready to bless them and value them. The Bible both the Old and new test yes constantly call on the followers of the Creator God to. Help the needy take care of the vulnerable. And so on not to devalue them all make some judgment about whether they're persons and therefore they have value and rights versus. Being human when they doesn't intrinsically have any rights it's 100 percent in one direction they were of infinite value Jesus Christ died for all human beings you know Dr Standish it's hard to believe that we are out of time but what approach found not just gone but reality. To accept. An account of origins outside the biblical account of origins has far reaching a fact. Because outside of it there is no value to a human being but with in it we value all human beings which is why we should feed the hungry why we should reach out to the poor why we should treat one another with respect even when we disagree because as you pointed out. In God's eyes every last one of us is of infinite value in his eyes such an infinite value. That he actually came to this earth to die for us to make us a new creation. Amazing Dr Standish Let's pray together. Lord we are so thankful that you made us and because you made us we are infinite in value in your eyes we thank you so much in Jesus' name amen amen. Dear friends what a profound thought. The master designer Jesus Christ crafted and made you with infinite value you know if you'd like to learn more about this Jesus who places infinite value on you I'd like to offer you the Discover Bible guides you'll be drawn nearer to him learn more about him here's the information you need to receive todays offer. To request today's offer just log on to W W W dot it is written canada dot ca That's W W W dot it is written canada dot ca and select the T.V. Program tab for Canadian viewers the offer will be sent free and postage paid for viewers outside of Canada shipping charges will apply if you prefer you may call toll free at 1888 call. That's 1888 call. Call any time lines are open 24 hours daily That's 1888 call I.I. W or if you wish you may write to us at it is written box 2010 Oshawa Ontario L. one H. 7 before that it is written box 2010 Oshawa Ontario L. one age 74. Dr Standish I want to thank you so much for this profound discussion on ethics you know the bottom line is in the biblical view of things humans are of infinite value in the Darwinian view they are of questionable that. You know dear friends. I want to thank you so much for watching and if you want to continue to learn more about this gaunt who places infinite value on you join us again next week and tell than Remember it is written man shall not live by bread alone but by every word that proceeds from the mouth of God.


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