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  • May 17, 2020
    4:15 PM


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Hello and welcome thank you so much for joining us I'm Dr Lee Lewis I'm the medical director of Avonex World Radio and a board certified obstetrician a gynecologist is up pleasure to have you with us this evening level of the 1st debuted program what it is level of why is it existing we're going to come from level up is a follow up to the very successful medical symposium that just finished last Sunday at your request the question came in how are we to deal with many of the concerns that we have globally as related to this covert 1000 crisis we want a respectable scientific location we can trust to get answers well as a result of that question and request level up came into existence we will be meeting every Sunday on an ongoing basis at 8 pm Eastern 5 pm Pacific as we address your concerns and your questions level out is sponsored or hosted by ad been a swirl of the radio and the 7th Day Adventist Church as 7th Day Adventists legal even holistic health physical mental emotional and spiritual well being and none can be separated for good health incorporates all and with that said I am very happy and excited to invite the president of admin its world radio my good friend Dr Duane that key to give us opening prayer and opening remarks as we begin this very exciting program. Thank you very much it's so exciting to see you here with us and happy with Ivan as well radio and I I want to welcome you and thank you for being a part of our ministry and also a class way to help relieve. The around the world and thank you so much welcome each one of you I'd like to have prayer with you and pray that God richly blessed as we learn together how it's probably healthier and live in a better way to price make more widespread father never thank you for your love thank you for days as he died for us we pray for for this program tonight that your name will be up that the thank you for Dr Leland Dr Levy and Pastor Mark been laid back with the only and may this be a wonderful experience as we grow closer to you and learn how to be healthier in Jesus' name amen amen thank you so much Dr the key Well as we said we have some very difficult questions to answer the quarantine dilemma the quenching dilemma why is it a dilemma a historical approach to a current controversy is what we're going to be discovering and investigating tonight but why is quarantine social distancing isolation whatever term you wish to call it why is it a dilemma well on one side as we know and as we suspect as we decrease social distancing it increases our risk of exposure clearly because we're coming in closer contact with more people for more exposure thereby more insects Chian possibility thereby increased mortality but on the other hand quieting in and of the cells could be causing deleterious effect in fact it is causing as we'll discover tonight increases in alcohol consumption depression anxiety and thereby increase in suicide domestic violence child abuse these are all very good concerns of course the ramifications of financial devastation we need to investigate this closer. Let's look at a deeper level let's go level up one up and find out some of the answers to these questions well in order to discover this quarantine dilemma and investigate it further we need to ask the question where did that 1000 come from when did it come into existence and how do we know it's a virus at all anyway Well to answer those questions I am very excited to introduce a good friend of mine and a very intellectual individual Dr Steven Lee I daresay Dr Lee is one of the best surgeons I've had the offer from the working with Dr Steven Lee is the vice chair of the ear nose and throat department at Loma Linda University he has his doctorate in medicine from Loma Linda University and he also has a Ph d. in molecular biology and biochemistry Dr Lee can you tell us a little bit about where did covert 1000 come about and how do we know it's a virus and it's infectivity to begin with. Yeah great question Leila So what we know is that the virus started when we 1st encountered it in the city of Homs China the doctors there started seeing a cluster of patients that had respiratory issues showing up in their hospitals in December of 2019 now they saw more more of these patients showing up in their hospitals and they tested all these patients for influenza r.s.p.b. and a virus all the other pathogens that we would normally expect to be causing this kind of symptoms and none of them came up positive so at this point they were wondering what they were dealing with and what they did if they sent some samples from the lung of bodges Brown to alveolar laws and sent it to various labs Raviv are doing that I this is a slight and from the Lancet article that was published earlier this year and this shows the 1st 41 patients that they found and you see that the 1st patient they knew about was back in December 1 of 200-1000 the last one they thought start having symptoms on January 1st and then they tried to see what he's paid his have in common and a significant portion of these patients were exposed to this wet market the Hunan seafood market exposure so they were thinking maybe it came from that market. So what they wanted to do next this find out what was causing this and what they did is they sent those samples to labs and the technology has increased the point now that we can do. What's called next generation sequencing and we can sequence entire genomes of organisms very quickly and they did this sequencing of these samples and they found out that a sequence matched up with the corona virus but no known coronavirus that we knew of before. And then they want to make sure is this a virus or is it just. Nucleic acids that are just found in the lungs so what they did in this other paper if they took samples and they grew it on respiratory virus respiratory epithelium in culture and it created more virus so they know now that it not only just the nucleic acids of a virus it is an active virus and Grandpa this work has been duplicated thousands of times now viral logy labs all over the world have now also isolated the virus and sequenced it and now there's 5000 different strains of this virus that are out and have been sequenced so doubt Carol I just want to thank. You John for coming back to what we just showed this last night yes actually what's there is saying is that the corona virus is mutate and these are different strains of how many mutations have taken place since that very beginning. Then to our case is that correct is that what you're saying yes the picture you're seeing here is something called a silent Genet tree and the very bottom left hand corner right here is the original strain and then bees are branches where they mutate and then you take again and again and again now most of these mutations are in consequential they're in non-coding regions they don't affect how the virus works for hot on chains That's why although there's 5000 different strains most of them are very similar or basically identical in terms of function although there are some new studies recently showing that there have been some consequential mutations that may become clinically except if you get. So. Right now I have got the dentist continue the timeline so this happened in December around January 11th and January 12th China let the World Health Organization know that they were dealing with a new virus at that point that kind of important thing if they did not tell the World Health Organization that it was person to person spread they were still thinking that it was a unique event from an animal to a person so they didn't know they didn't they weren't thinking that it was important virus at that point. Then by January 20th we started seeing cases in other countries so Korea and the u.s. had their 1st case on 20 twentieth's then on Jan 22nd we were trying to inform the World Health Organization that there was person to person transmission and the lot down the city of on the 24 and then on the 30th of January the b.h.o. declares it a public health emergency of international concern which is a pandemic and then. In February most countries started restrict travel from China to try to protect themselves and then in March most countries started doing in from a lot downs of shelter at home orders and then Currently this is a rat or this is data that's current as of this morning there's almost 5000000 cases worldwide and about 300000 deaths and this is the graph of the daily new cases and heat down here in January February March is a very small numbers and then there was a big ramp up throughout March and then we stabilized at around 80000 cases a day and this stabilization is probably because of all the. The government lock downs and shutdowns that have been done across the world or else you'd see more of a parabolic curve here would be the natural course of the virus. That's happened and we're talking so bad that we weren't paid for what you're saying and again it started in one hon China there were a lot of ideas as far as where it originally came from and we'll be talking about some of those in just a few minutes was it mutated strain was it mutated on purpose there's a lot of different ideas and theories out there you know what one thing that came out of this that is unfortunate is this racial profiling you know it it it seems to follow sometimes you know when we don't know exactly what things are where things are coming from it seems that sometimes we respond with various forms of racial profiling whether that be to the Asian community and to our specifically to the Chinese community I'm going to invite my good friend and mentor Dr Mark and when I refer to him as Pastor Mark that's your mark is usually a login he has a doctorate and then it's very versed on the history international super and special assistant to the president of the General Conference a 7th Day Adventist Pastor Mark in your exploration of very proud using the past where friendship and racial profiling sometimes go hand in hand and how should a Christian or an individual concerned with the banana tree and communities how should we respond. With Thank you Dr Hua that is a very significant question. When you look at the pen Democrats that have taken place throughout history we have had about 7 major pandemics the 1st one was in the 2nd century 165000000 Tonio pandemic and then you go to 265 there was another major pandemic and you go throughout history and 5 point one another one to go up to 13 hundreds of the bonnet plague in each of these pandemics that there have been people who have been scapegoated I will give you one good example in 1347 you had the Bebo Nick playing that came through Europe at that time and many of the Jewish communities were not experiencing the same death rates much less death rates than the larger European community and so the Jews who are blame they were scapegoated for the in bubonic plague at one time in one of the European countries 2000 Jews were burned to death just horrible on another Rick if there were $510.00 Jewish communities that were destroyed during that time because they were scapegoated they were blamed for this. And the Jews of course had far less deaths from the place largely because of 3 reasons one is they did social isolation they were usually socially isolated they had base that on the Levitical was a bit of his 1314 also they were very cleanly they they were Jewish mandates require the washing of hands before you eat and they were very clearly in that area and also they were very careful with their contact with others and their clothing they were very meticulous about keeping it clean and. One of the reasons from the Christian ethic that issue look back on history from the Christian ethic every human being has values every human being. Worse than guts and it's called the image of gone from a Christian perspective we believe that every human being has created an image of go out so any kind of racial profiling whether it's the racial profiling of the Jews from the bubonic plague the racial profiling sedan of the Chinese is a total fire way sion of that Christian ethic because every human being whatever background whatever culture whatever ethnicity whatever language group we believe in being created in the image of God and every human being should be treated with worth and dignity and the respect that comes from being great in gods and Thank you Pastor Mark you know one thing when I think back to the 1918 pandemic we spent the last 4 weeks investigating that with the medical supposin which by the way if you haven't had a chance for who watch those demonstrations we do ask you please though for aid. For its last well and you can access those are videos that we spent a lot of time talking about in 1910 when the Unfortunately many people referred to it as the Spanish flu again and there was some racial profiling even then so it's something we definitely want to pay close attention to and be careful now doctoring me I want to come back to this question SARS those who are of the Kobe 1904 Asian. Summers Celtic's hero are the virus that causes coded sender is not the very 1st corona virus that we humans have come encounter with her many other times I mean from encounter with a clone of I Dr Lee Yeah the father thoughtfully wrote I could throw the flight up here. Asarco he too is actually defendant corona virus that people have been exposed to therefore with these funny names o.c. 43 h k u 122090 all 63 these are crevices that caught the common cold they have very mild symptoms they've been with us for a long time. And then there's 3 viruses that have been more recently in primary. That's the SARS Kovi virus which could start SARS and then the MERS virus and then the most recent SARS Kovi 2 which causes covert 19 and those cost potentially severe disease so going over start to it 1st encountered in 2002 in infection bats and palm civet sweeps of the small mammals and humans it uses a stool as a port of entry that's just like coded manging and then samples from the wound on wet market just write them up markets and we were on found that the virus and ponced of it were being sold there then. Since 2002 there's been what 8000 cases and 800 extra That's what a 10 percent Batali rate for stars and then the last known case with in 2004 for we haven't seen any new gaiters a few $1004.00 so far this is a contained virus was born then more recently there was a virus called Merv's which was present countered in Saudi Arabia in 2012 and that one in fact bats Hamilton human uses a different protein in a cell that affordable intreat probably little Has that happened before and large file papers are found in camel camel yet merged but they have no symptoms from it and they're not they don't get sick from it but they shed fire and then they can you know if people in people it's quite deadly there's been 2400 cases and 900 deaths which is about a 35 percent rate and this virus continue to have infection that pop up every year but not contained but it's that kind of a very minimal amount of cases every year fortunately. And I mean yeah he said he's human and that's Mary entrenched in our the new nonsense animal human transmission with Corona virus seems to be relatively common in fact correct yeah so I mean those are the cold viruses are also thought to be zoonotic and you need viruses they basically they attack different animals differently so in fact they don't really cause them to get sick but sometimes they transfer over and the viruses are able to have a more mutational that lets them infect humans and sometimes those. Those viruses cause very mild symptoms in humans like the ones they call the common common cold and sometimes it's quite deadly like murders and then in this case we discovered maintain it's not as deadly as SARS and Mers fortunately but it seems to be very transmissible So it's that's why we have now $4500000.00 known cases and 300000 deaths and depend on it is ongoing and the main difference between SARS MERS and Pope in 1000 is that SARS and Mers have very severe symptom and the patrons cannot transmit the disease before they have symptoms so when you when they get sick and if you isolate them then they you can perfect from giving it to other people but Copen 19 there is a lot of data that shows that people can completely asymptomatic or very mildly symptomatic but still be spreading the disease. Which of course makes it much more complicated and kind of pushes as we are going to borrowing this quarantine dilemma that actually puts a back further to mind if you're nice and if you will as far as position in time of life that are Corinth Mel out there Mark I have a question a follow up question to those you not it. Terminology that Dr Lee has talked to is about as far as coronaviruses are concerned. If you're any trainer we're looking at history we're comparing notes during For consider how and what we should deal with this is this the lemma of the quarantine but I daresay in one part senses fire at a distance from animals you know close proximity to animals live or if they might even come into play here is more any thing in the Bible or in history that might you know plumbing big nation that perhaps need to consider. Keeping at least some limited defense between us and other animals. Well if you go back to the Book of Genesis God gave the human race a plant based diet and fruits not springs that shrivels where the original are given to the human beings. Throughout the Old Testament just before the time of the slug when you look at the flood the catastrophe that destroyed much of the world the entire world wrecked to a worldwide slug the animals were taken into the ark they came in by clean animals by sevens and until you animals fight to. The Levitical laws the ancient Jews look back at the Levitical laws and they saw it from will because 11 for example that unclean animals were never to be eaten shortly after the flood God gave permission it meant clean animals of course the vegetarian diet was always the best it's rather fascinating for of a curious to see the outbreaks of covert 19 in many of the meat packing plants you know most since that's just because of close proximity but I'm wondering what future studies will reveal but the interesting thing to me very specifically in the Old Testament if an animal died. That animal was known to be a disease care. Here and The Old Testament Jews were forbidden even to touch it so I think we can learn a great deal not simply from we got a list of requirements in the Old Testament but I think there are principles principles of isolation when you come to see these principles of very cleanliness principles of washing and principles of dealing before they even need germ theory they understood the importance of not handling the dead and so that I think is quite significant I agree that's fascinating Pastor Mark you know for those of you viewing right now we have a very special guest that we want to provide to you if you would like to have a personal conversation with myself and Pastor Mark on any of these topics related to the quarantines and lemme we are offering right now for the 1st 20 people that share the link of where you're watching right now write and tell us to share the link and we will give you that opportunity of having a very interesting conversation with the 2 of us so we just wanted to offer that to you right now and it's one of the live comments section of your program well I want to come back to one other fact when Dr Lee there as we often then send you know kind of briefly there's a lot of theories out there some of them somewhat controversy all as the where in the world SARS coast to pain from we already mentioned you know some people talk about it being genetically modified was that purposeful was that not what we've talked now about the close proximity to animals than the fact that it was near a market a wet market can you tell us a little bit from science has typically we want to investigate what the likelihoods 1st of all what's the likelihood that SARS to was genetically modified by the Chinese government Yeah so I think this is something that. Been in the news for you know in the new cycle like was this thing genetically modified because we know that there is a fire ology level located in one China so there was a paper published back in March in Nature Medicine that looked at this exact question and what these people did is they analyzed the genetic sequence of the virus and what they found out is they think it's very unlikely that was genetically modified for 2 reasons one is there is something called Despite protein and the spike protein is the. Part of the virus that is used to and to gain entry into ourselves and that's by protein is very good at binding to human race too and so when they look at the sequence that's right this protein is not seen in any of our known viruses but it works very well if someone were to be wanting to genetically engineer a pathogen they would use a spiked protein that we already know of or they would use a spike protein that our computer models would say would work so then. Why would they do that this thing right in the melody any why would they do because like it's the way it works is like to think of it as a key and a lock and so if you know if you are to know that she that works why would you not use that so that would be like previous virus like SARS that you know has a key that works or you have a computer program that tells you what if you make this key this key should work otherwise you're just randomly trying to tease and a lot and seeing if one works which would be a very inefficient way of doing it and so this one is like a key that does not exist before before we found this one and it's a key that would be was predicted not to work but it does work. So if someone was doing it they would use a key that's known to work or the that's predicted to work and if you don't want to write here and then number 2 there's because it's such a large virus it requires a pretty sophisticated version at against insistence that work with it and those systems all have a very distinctive back on and a fingerprint and this one doesn't display any fingerprints. Of a lab system that would have been used to make it looks very it wild like a wild virus so those 2 things make it pretty unlikely that was modified very intense Coming up thank you so much now running a play there is men and differing approaches that the blow has taken her act. How to respond to this that your ranks and we have everything very like very everything from countries such as Korea to Sweden and of course the United States Europe Asia where the American the United States and taken very different approaches can you just show us very briefly some of the different effects of quarantine and spies the about ways people have done it and the results that has come out of that sure I think when we discuss other countries approaches to dealing with one thing we have to understand that every country is a little bit different in its culture in how excessive all it is like how much travel there is in and out of it how dense the population is and how how. How willing the people are to deal with. Things like privacy invasion and tracing of contacts so I think one solution doesn't work for all countries so every country has a slightly different response that they felt was best for them so I mean there's a lot of countries that can't go through all the country responses but I thought that we would go through some of the countries that maybe we have heard of in the news now Italy is one of the countries that we've all heard about because they were hit pretty early and pretty hard and. What their approach was is they thought that they could kind of modify the amount of quarantine that they were going to do based on how bad the disease was that they were going to react ratchet it up or down based on how about it what the problem being at this like a 2 week lacked from when you do an intervention to when you see the effect so if you wait too for the data on the ground then you're always kind of 2 weeks behind what they did is they they started doing that and it rapidly went out of control and at that point they realized what we need to slot everything down and they were very. Invasive about locking things down they had police on the streets keeping people from going anywhere but you see that they had a pretty large spike in March we all heard about in the news and sensed a lot on they've had a downward trend in their down to a very low level and they are add about $40000000.00 cases $30000.00 deaths and that's a death rate based on the population about $500.00 per 1000000 death rate Germany is another country we actually saw what was happening in Italy and they implemented their lock down early they were never overwhelmed and they're they're kind of under control at this point they're starting to open back up which in their country is a point of point of debate. But they've started to open back up but USA we still we started our lockdown in March as well we have a ramp up so you see we start to lock down there's like a true week delay before you see the result of it and we have a plateau because we haven't had as stringent a lockdown at other countries. And so we are at one point by the many days that we are very large countries go comparatively that you know could be not in many cases the fiddle in fact and our death rate is 273 per 1000000. No I think the 2 countries want to focus the roast on is South Korea and Sweden because those 2 countries are in the news quite a bit for the way that they handled it they handled it very differently. So South Korea has a very compliant culture people are coping with listening to gordie and they have a kind of a collective with our Me which means they care a little bit less about individual rights and more about how the group does and so they had a very large outbreak actually very early on because there was. A person involved with a large religious group in a city called a true and she's read it to like 10000 people they had 810000 person I'll be very early and the way they decided to handle it is they were ready with massive testing very early on and they tested everyone and what they did is they would test someone and then after the test if someone they would find out if you're positive they would ask the hand over their cell phone using their cell phone data they would be got all the places they'd been in the previous 2 weeks when they were lined up all the people they were in contact in the furious 2 weeks test all of them anxious positive they would repeat that procedure and go back in time and treat several people and then after they found out everyone who was positive if you were positive but did have symptoms you were told to stay home and they would put a tracer app on your phone to make sure you stayed home if you have moderates and don't they would send you to a hotel that the government had set up for that or if you're sick you they would send you the hospital but they were very invasive about tracing people and then isolating them and but that allowed them to keep most businesses open because they knew who was positive and who would not they did not have any travel restrictions they let people fly in from China and other places except for the few big problems which were. And they had been masked wearing and then they had daily updates on their public health officials every day on t.v.. From until this is how do you see that Korea Spike happened back in February they were hit very early and then they haven't they got pretty rapid control and they've had a very low simmer of cases and there and so you see their chase logs they were at one point the 2nd highest country but now they're very low They're only 11 dozen cases $260.00 deaths and they have a phenomenally low death rate of 5 per 1000000 and so sweet you of tea in the news quite a bit and because they've handled it. Very uniquely their government has been pretty hands off in terms of legal measures they have their country with high social trust the people tend to trust each other and they have a drop really helping younger population and a very robust health care system so what the government did is they asked people hey there's this pandemic going around we trust you guys and you'd like to stay away from each other work from home as much as possible and they said if you get sick he stay home don't go to work we will make sure you get your old salary if you stay home because your stick they got rid of our service restaurant for the you have meet standards did it next you to a bar but restaurants stayed open they canceled mass events but there was no closure of borders they elementary school it opened because they thought that kids do very well and that elementary school very important but they closed down the high school and college in Perth and Platzman But basically all business and shop remained open and still when you look at the data out of Sweden you can see people did. Well the government recommendation is there the businesses and the bars in the restaurants are not as busy but people still go and there's much less traffic and movement of people when you track them by people apps. And so what you see with Sweden is great you have in many cases and they are doing this on purpose they've not herd immunity they want our aid they brought let me go further I thought he got that many people are a little confused basically hearing that terminology front around quite a bit herd immunity what is herd immunity so Purdum unity is this idea that if you have enough people in your population that have been exposed either by a vaccine or by the actual disease there is then they have immunity in the act kind of as a wall so for example if I'm in a crowd of people and I happen to xiv but most of the people around me are immune to it and there's a few that are not then i will they the virus to not get to the person that doesn't have immunity because most of the people are immune and so the virus just doesn't have another host to get to and I believe that's around 70 percent isn't that. Yeah I think for about 5 percent it's about it being heard in any percentage depends on what what's called the are not you might have heard of that on the news as well and that's basically tells you how transmissible to the virus is if the if it's more transmissible you need a higher percentage if it's less offensive or you need a lower percentage but somewhere between like 50 to 70 percent when you get heard of unity so what you see because we actually have a relatively high death rate is higher than the United States at 346 and they are having this kind of plateau where they're having about 600 new cases a day and that is by design they're not worried about that they they want to go through their population and they think their population their healthcare system a strong enough that they can let it go through. I mean this is what is going on in America in America. You can see that kind of that that small states that have small populations like Montana and Vermont it's a population not land mass but are are are getting having things under control can they have relatively few cases and places like Alaska Hawaii that have that can control movement in either state Alaska in Hawaii have very strict rules for visitors you know working before he made to go there and they're able to control that Michigan New York have done some pretty severe lockdown measures and they're getting their things under control but the vast majority of states are either you know ramping up phase or a back to base at this point. Right appear as Actually if you go back to that slide or just want to make one quick comment when you consider the mean as as I was doing on your 1st slide We should they were actually kind of up the curve and came down so there's only a downward fall there are more of states that still are on the upward rise and so the average seems to be this plateau as you mentioned which seems to fall more along the lines I daresay of the Swedish community seeking herd immunity with near the Cessna I think what's going on is that. That switch and that in America have pretty much similar levels of their own swift the fish population did it voluntarily in the American population is doing it more by the government closing the businesses but I think the effectiveness if you if you think about all the people still going grocery shopping and things like that is about the same we're having the same trajectory so we're probably headed towards whether by design or by people toward hurting anybody at Pets remark I have a question for you clearly we you know we have a situation is different depending on what state you're from what country you're from a clearly the way to create things is very different than Sweden and I daresay very different than the United States but the great issue with quarantine it's challenging as we said at the beginning it's not just quite as cut and dry as yes we want to decrease the more talent associated with coke at 19 yes we want to decrease the risks of those at in the higher population risk category but what about the patients who are not necessarily coming down the coast that they're just getting the effect for quarantine such as social distancing causing an increase in depression alcohol abuse drug dependence even physical abuse domestic violence and child abuse has your family have you what is your take on on on that particular topic. Well child abuse Walter Messick violence is certainly a very very serious issue that cannot be taken lightly I think one of the issues with parents who have children who are socially isolated kids who are not in school for example it's I think incredibly important that parents and children are able to have open discussions about covert 19 open discussions about their inability to be at school and why I think parents sued to be able to talk to their children explain it to their children and also I talked to a number of parents with young families during the Co The 19 crisis and these parents are taking opportunities to bond with their children in fact one mother said you know I really kind of like that yes because I'm having a greater opportunity to bond with my children playing games with their kids. Playing in the yard with them having an opportunity if you come from a thinks the background to share the word of God with your kids there's so many opportunities I think that we have to bond with our children during this time of crisis you know it's really interesting when you look at the biblical material there are a number of times in Scripture that we see 14th day which you could call quote unquote quarantines. Jesus you know spent 40 days in the wilderness. And it was a time of prayer a time of testing Moses spent 40 days even praying before the deliverance of the children of Israel from Egypt so you can look at I think at Orenstein it one of 2 ways one you can look at it as isolationism and. A time of frustration anxiety tension the other way you can look at it as a time of meditation a time of prayer a time to re-evaluate your life's a time to re-evaluate your family priorities a time for a closer to your children so I think it's a mind set to a lot of where what we are thinking about and taking something that could be quite negative and using years of the time to bond with our family it's. That's fascinating and Dr Steve. Have you seen anything in the great fares to show. The risk of mortality with quarantine especially in light of what Pastor Mark is saying I think that's so up likeable and I'm just thinking personally I am a single mom with 4 little ones and I've actually taken this opportunity like you said to do some of the things I haven't had the opportunity to do before like plant a garden and take care of all kinds of things that needed to be taken care of but back to me Have you seen anything in the research that might indicate that if we don't have that problem that it mentality that we can actually be increasing our mortality on the other side of the stick as well yeah absolutely there is there is several papers on it there was one recently that was that in pre-print they were looking at Swift data and they looked specifically at suicide depression alcohol abuse and domestic violence child violence change and marital status and social isolation and they basically according to their mathematical model they said that about 2 percent of the population will be greatly affected by some by a stay at home water and on average that 2 percent would lose about 9 years of life. Because of that and then there was another what's called a systematic review of many papers that was published in 2011 so well before the folk over 1000 things and they show that unemployment itself gives you a hazard ratio of 1.63 and what that means is that let's say that as a like middle aged healthy guy my risk of dying in the next 5 years of one percent if I have a has to reach a 1.63 that means I'm 63 percent more likely to die in the next 5 years so instead of a one percent of 1.63 percent likely to die so I don't blame it itself has some mortality risk so not just the economic risks of a shutdown but there's a lot of mental health and. You know public health risks of a problem just don't and that you know I'm thankful I had cancer Mack you know I think to pick up on what Dr Lee has said that I think it becomes quite critical to be sensitive to what's going on in families sensitive to signs of suicide sensitive to depression in children sensitive to marriage difficulties and because as Dr Lee was mentioning unemployment can bring not only financial and economic challenges but it can bring its. Challenges that have to do with attitudes with discouragement oppression it's about 16 percent of Americans currently of the United States are on unemployment that may go up to 20 percent about 3000000 people of course filed for unemployment you know in a single week we have about 30000000 people unemployed in this country right now it's and I was looking at one of the United Nations studies by Dr David Beasley and Dr Beazley put it this way he said that we had maybe things seeing in the developing countries a famine and these were his words of biblical proportions because if you have an economic crisis in the developing world that means what unless aid for the developed world right so how do you approach this from a historical perspective how do you approach this from the theological perspective if you just throw up your hands and say well nothing really done about this from a theological perspective I think there are 2 major issues number one is the issue of personal trust in God. Where you look at some of the statements in Scripture they are so incredibly reassuring Philippians Paul writes to Philip be at the church it filled up my chapter 4 verses. And he says Michael Shear supply all your needs according to His riches and Borys there is something about trust something about a bit Roth faith that enables us to transend the. Trans in the challenges of ice I was looking at another study that was done on how does state that impact a person in poverty how does faith impact a person in poverty and this study indicated that if you are a person who is in poverty and you have faith in Europe life expectancy is much longer because you even in a developing world learn to get along with much less so there is something about faith that releases positive chemical indoor fins in the mind that enables them body to respond in health no I do not mean to minimize in any way famine and that's where I come in the 2nd area so the 1st way I think I think you have to deal with this repression perspective a biblical perspective on to it's the 1st is the level of personal faith the 2nd level is the level of corporate responsibility where the Christian church has a responsibility to minister to those in need if you look back at crisis is in play it's the Christian church was the 1st to establish hospitals and I have something just really amazing I discovered the other day I was going back and taking a look at the plea that took place in 268 degree and there was a Bishop Dionysius who was there with your church in Corinth at the time this is sort center the 3rd century and he comments on how Christians. Minister to those in need during the break want to reach do something for the 3rd century Vince fascinated and he's writing about this and he says most of our brother Christian should unbounded love and loyalty never Spirit himself and thinking only of one another key to us of danger they took charge of the sick attending to the every need ministering to them in Christ and with them departed this life serenely happy for they were infected by others with the disease drawing on themselves the sickness of their main bridges in cheerfully accepting their payments through the Christian ethic is to put into the middle of need so whether that is depression where a create with a Christian ethic is to invite somebody to their whole myth and provide a meal for them provide a safe place of refuge whether that is providing food for the poor in the food pantry where that is a providing medical care and not long ago I interviewed a number of nurses and doctors and e.m.t. emergency medical technicians from New York City and I was amazed at these godly people how they plunged into human need so I think the biblical ethic is twofold number one a personal space been able to transcend what's going on around you and 2nd a Christian ethic that realizes that the image of God is formed in every human being and that we have a responsibility to help them physically mentally and spiritually have a. Profound and you know as I think back to this current situation and where where where we discussed some of the dilemmas related to the choir 900 situation I think there's one last thing that I wanted to bring out and it's the question of vaccines you know we there's about over 100 vaccines that are being studied right now that Julie just very briefly. What is your take do we are we likely to have a vaccine that's able to provide to us the immunity that smallpox debt and if not I think that leaves us where Pastor Martin just talked about that having that faith and understanding that God has a plan that tell us a little bit about vaccines Please Well I don't think I can predict the future and whether vaccine work I certainly hope we get one but just looking for historical data the bastards that seem those ever produced was the months that scene in 1957 and that took 4 years and that's the best we've ever done it the most recent major vaccine we developed was one for Ebola that took 19 years to develop and SARS we've been they've been working on a SARS vaccine since 2012 and emerged that seems I mean emerged decades 2012 and we don't have one and there has never been a vaccine for Corona virus in the history of mankind ever successfully made no there hasn't been the amount of scientific input and funding and governmental pressure to do it like now so if we haven't tried as hard as we are now to do it so that doesn't mean that it's impossible but there is currently 8 that are in clinical studies and 110 that are preclinical studies. But I think in just my opinion I think this idea that we're going to vaccine in a year and a half is a pretty unlikely. So I don't think that that's what's needed a said to there and say it's very unlikely we're just going to do immunity norm the natural way which I think and I think the herd immunity and by so leads me has to mark you know we just finished the medical symposiums and we've talked about optimizing one's immunity using the immune system I daresay that God gave us intended for us to news and even gave us a special Dolly at all only back in eat and that helps us to optimize our immunity so again if you haven't seen those programs go to a. Oh Archie forward slash health and access those are kind of videos now have to mark coming back to history because as we delve into this quarantine dilemma in history really is the key in fact one of my favorite authors had a statement we have nothing to fear from the future lest we forget how God has let us in the past and as I think about that I think about the germ theory that came about 861 with Louis Pasteur me for what I did that before we understood germ theory where there are cases of Korean teen and if so how were those taken about well the 1st public health officer was Moses and Moses as a public health officer gave some very interesting guidelines when it came to quarantine one guideline was on leprosy Now just imagine there's at least a 1000000 and a have probably 2000000 Israelites that leave Egypt their living in very close proximity a disease can spread so incredibly rapidly through their camp and so in the book of Leviticus Chapter 3013. Verse $45.46 not the priest Incidentally the religious leaders were also the medical directors in those days and so it says now the leper on whom the sore is on his clothes shall be torn and his head bear and he shows cover his moustache and cry uncle you know and clean he shall be unclean all the days that he has this or he showed well home in his habitation shall be outside the camp so the 1st coroutine we find is. This leper is taken from Israel he is placed outside the camp he is checked by the priest on a regular basis until he is able to return to the camp now there were a couple other levels in ancient Israel there were times that the priest would check a person and if indeed they had a disease that was minor not significant they would be separated or isolated for 7 days there were other times that if mildew was forming in a house in the priest would check at that house would be cleansed and left alone with nobody living in it and then it would be it would be either demolished if it still had the mildew in or it would be. Back in now but the interesting thing is let me give you 2 historical. True Hicks historical experiences of core indeed the 1st time we find quarantine in other than biblical times that's of any significance at all as during the bubonic plague in $1347.00 during that time in finishing the sailors came in on boats and many of that some of these boats came in 90 percent of the same as would dead or ready the others we had raging scene for and so they begin to quarantine these sailors 1st for 30 days then for 40 days and these sailors were quarantined to help control the disease now you come from 136526060 thought of during that 300 year period every 20 years in Europe there was another major outbreak of the bubonic plague. In England in the 16th 15th century in London 20 percent of the population was killed but here's what they did they put a bale of hay on a pole in front of a person's house and that person was quarantined and anybody from that house came into the city they had to carry a White Bull and some meat so we have these historical stories of the attempt to control disease by public health mess that it's but the interesting thing there is a theologian is that you have the roots of these ancient scriptures that's fascinating that's absolutely fascinating yeah it sounds very similar what they did in the bonnet plag to what took place in the then I guess and even the 40 days I mean I must I must ask the question is there some relationship with that 40 days and 40 days in the wilderness 40 days in the bible of the Nishan how much what that those days based on the Bible as well as we you know we can't know for sure but we know this Moses is in the wilderness praying 40 days there's 40 days and nights before of the rain falling through the flood Jesus is in the witness 40 days 40 years David rains 40 years so rains 40 years solid rains so I'm sure and you know our Catholic friends have this 40 year 40 days of the limits in Venetia was a Catholic area the word quarantine you know what that word means it means testing a time of testing followed by a new ice pass and it comes from the word quare Rent-A which is sort of so the very word for quarantine has its linguistic roots in court in which is 40 so I'm not sure what Biblical significance there was in that but I wouldn't be surprised if there was very significant biblical significance in the whole idea of warranty. That that's amazing Pastor Mark it's absolutely amazing you know I am I know there are some other questions that we want to get to but perhaps in our question and answer session but I I have another question for you Pastor Mark as we look at this and where he had you know we're dealing with obviously from science Dr Levy regaling with a quarantine dilemma social distancing isolation whatever word we want to call it as as we're looking at that and we're looking at actually seeing some history going all the way back to Leviticus and relationship quarantine could it be that perhaps this might even bike you said before it depends on how we look at it from our own mental perspective and what kind of peace can we have in this unsettling time. Well 1st we recognize that God is not the author of sickness or disease it's that this is not some kind of play that God inflicts upon people God is a God awful lot but we live in a broken world in the book of Romans chapter 8 it says the whole creation Romans until now in this broken world God created a beautiful world a world filled with perfection but he gave human beings the freedom of choice if you take away the freedom of choice you take away the opportunity to vote and if you take away the opportunity so you take away the ability to be happy so because God wanted beings that were loving and responded not his robots he gave them the capacity to choose when our 1st parents made that choice to listen to the voice of the evil one who had rebelled against God in Heaven in this great controversy between good and evil God didn't create a demon he created a magnificent angel but he gave him the ability to choose and so if this world was plunged into rebellion or sins separated from God Who. In a broken world and pathogens grow in that world and germs and bacteria and viruses grow in sickness it's where is God in all this God is with us in sickness he's working with every medical personnel who's ministering in love he's working through the hearts and minds of his people to develop the best modalities to deal with the disease but where is he when a person gets sick he's by their side giving them hope giving them encouragement and I think one of the things that may kill more people than covert 19 is worry and see here and I think worry and fear spreads more rapidly even than cool that 19 there's order for passage in Scripture in Isaiah 41 verse 10 that says this fear not for I am with you be not afraid I will strengthen you I will uphold you with the right hand of my righteousness and so we can find peace in a time of storm we can find comfort in a time of disaster and killed at 19 by a trusting relationship with God who will never forsake us and never leave us. You have to do you have any closing remarks spare the worries for today and a closing fair you don't mind surely whatever you are going through in your life right now it could be a problem at home in your marriage you may be struggling with alcoholism you may be struggling with discouragement or you may be facing the onslaught of disease there is a god that cares that loves that will give you the power to overcome whatever attitude or habit that you're struggling with. And as we pray you can have the absolute assurance of God's love and care let's pray for Father in heaven we want to thank you for the opportunity of knowing you as we look back in history we see that these planes are nothing that is or have caught you by surprise that we live in a world of good and evil we live in a world of disease sickness but you were there there are principles of health in the Bible that build our immune systems to keep us well a good diet adequate water and fresh air and exercise in rats we thank you for those principles but also enable us to have eyes to see and ears to hear the hurt going on in other people's lives and help us to recognize the image of God created in every human being and Collinge into this world's need to make a difference for your kingdom in Christ's name. Amen Well thank you both here thank you so much for joining us and thank you viewers for joining us for level up again this was our fairy 1st program but we are so happy to have the opportunity of talking with you and investigating further before we go to our question any answer session I do want to invite you to next Sunday's program is going to be very exciting it's called self attack fight back to self attack fight back it's about auto immune disease we're hearing a lot about that children being affected with this Kawasaki like send drone and some other syndromes that are affecting adults all vasculitis the resulting in blood clots so you're not going to want to miss next week when we talk about your own body attacking itself and how you can fight back and win in this battle Ok Well at this time we are excited to offer some question and answer is a very 1st question that came in and this is to have both our panelists before we answer the one on your screen as closing churches and wearing masks limits our religious liberty and our freedom of conscience and I'm going to start that one with Pastor Mark and then I want to come to Dr Lee And have you answer that from a scientific perspective if you don't mind. Well from Avery mergers perspective it's very fascinating you know there's a doctor Leyla 2 things 1st if you look at Korea the it's 1st person who began to transmit the code that 19 did so in a church from a church service was a large gathering about $10000.00 people and it just spread rapidly just in the news today breaking news an individual attended a Mother's Day celebration in a church and that person tested positive there were $180.00 people there and that's spreading So what is the. Ethic the Christian ethic is who love your neighbor as yourself so that if I love my neighbor as myself what do I want to do I don't want to be thinking about myself but I want to protect my neighbor from a disease that I may have even if I'm asymptomatic entrancement not transmit that disease so wearing a mask is an act of graciousness and love not simply to protect me but to protect my neighbor as well. Quarantine is an act of love toward my neighbor so that's when it comes to mass and what about church services in the book of Romans it says respect authority is the higher authorities and. So. As Christians we don't violate a government mandate indeed unless that government mandate is contrary very specifically to one of the commandments of the art and so there are many other ways to have worship besides meeting together you know if the government said you cannot worship that then it violates the very commandments of God and we could not accept that but there are many other ways to worship you can work we have in our church we have online worship and every week we'll have 100-150-2000 extension 0 people that are watching the online services I spoke this last week of how to survive an economic crisis and we have a web page Hope Lives 365 and people go there so from a spiritual perspective the basis of all of this the basis of self quarantine the basis of masks the basis of not meeting corporately in the church is love your neighbor as you love yourself and desire. Or your neighbor to be well that's that's the name Dr Lee very briefly do you think in your scientific evaluation that masks aren't official and if we know it's not a violation of our religious liberty in fact it's an opportunity of actually sizing on liberty and helping others what is your perspective on that's I think that a lot of people misunderstand mast as a way of protecting themselves mass are not a way of protecting yourself mast are a way of protecting others from you so there are 2 different kinds of masters and 95 mask those are somewhat protective of the wearer and but that's not what we're asked to wear out in public we're asked to wear just cough masks or regular masks and people are like well we you know they hear on the news reports no viruses go right through those masks Yes they do that's true and so what they are mainly doing is if you're coughing or talking little droplets come out of your mouth and that was mass stop that and so it reduces the amount of virus that you're shedding if you have it and that's the important because this disease you may be in a carrier of the virus and not know it you may feel completely fine if you have the virus and you may be spreading it to other people so the mask is not to protect you it's to protect others from you. Excellent thank you can I think of another question it's come in how did my demands help the body fight the virus Well now we take a really long time I appreciate that question it's an amazing question what I would ask you to do is please refer to the medical symposium again on a. Forward slash health and access those programs that in essence you are going to want to attend next week where Pastor Mark and myself and Dr Uganda woods are going to be addressing the topic of vitamins and nutrition so don't miss out next week as well how they answer the question about possibly it coming back in the fall and what I believe this question refers to is a 2nd wave we've heard a lot about that in the news the c.d.c. has been warning about that Dr fall she has been talking about that Dr Lee what's your opinion as far as a 2nd wave in the fall. So again for it in the future is always dangerous business but if we go by you know the thing that we always talk about of the 9800 pandemic that one had 3 ways the 1st wave was pretty small and people thought it was not a big deal the 2nd wave is where like more than 90 percent of that that's came and so the 1st wave ended in the summer which is about now and the 2nd way fit in October and that was the big wave so if we know that a very small percent of the population has been exposed we do not have heard immunity at this point there's not a vaccine we are starting to release these restrictions it's highly likely that we're going to experience a 2nd wave. Excellent thank you so much pressure Ok response for Pastor Mark what's the danger of Christians running conspiracy theories about vaccines before we add sir that particular topic very briefly Dr Levy a you mentioned as far as the vaccinations and the likelihood of it not being very promising at least by fall when we're talking about everyone going back to school and those kinds of things but Pastor Mark what's this conspiracy theory what's an answer to this question is Is this a concern as a theological perspective and even for those of us just in regular life let's look back at the history of that scenes and raise this question what impact have that scene's on the health of this world and having made a difference if you look at the smallpox vaccine that was developed it has saved millions and millions of lives if you look at the polio vaccine that was developed and saved millions of law it's. Now. Do we need to be careful with the rigorous scientific testing of vaccines definitely are there are dangers and could there be dangers possible as Dr we has clearly pointed out that seems at times to take 4 here it's 10 years. The 15 years to develop and so is far as conspiracy theories in vaccines I personally do not put much stock in them I think we have to look at rigorous science and deal with the scientific aspects and look at the benefit that vaccines have banned to the human race throughout the years now from a biblical perspective the Bible does not teach that that some anti-Christ power is going to use of that scene to control the mind of people with the Bible does teach what it's all about very frankly the mark of the beast in the seal of thought it talks about big commitment to Christ a commitment to Biblical truth a commitment in the mind to Thea's way of life so this whole issue of the end of Christ the beast power is not dealing with control through vaccine it's rather dealing with the control of your mind through the deceptions of state. Very very well said and Dr Lee I know I've heard you and I had this discussion as well on many occasions as far as conspiracy theories and general what would be your recommendation from a scientist perspective on how we can delve into finding out the actual truth of the matter as opposed to perhaps another theory that might take us down the wrong path you know I think. This is a very modern problem where we have so much access to information that it's very easy for people to cherry pick information and piece this narrative together that puts forth some kind of conspiracy theory and it's very easy to do that and you can find a video of those presentations that are very compelling and they talk to you and they have the facts and the facts are true but the omit the facts that don't support their side and to just get the facts that support their story and so it's a difficult problem I think if people are actually interested in that they need to talk to people that are experts that they trust. That can that information and try to go to the primary sources if you can but an island. And sometimes of vaccines I would say that the reason the vaccines take so long to develop is because when we develop certain drugs we always test them to their testing in medical science called Phase one face to face 3 trials and basically the 3 trial is the large trial where they try to figure out all the side effects and stuff with small drugs they they will accept. Greater numbers of side effects because you're only giving it to like you know 100000 people 10000 people but a vaccine you're going to get to milk billions of people so even if something gives you a 0 point one percent bad side effect 0 point one percent of a 1000000 people is still a lot of people so vaccines yet they have to be very rigorously tested so that their side effect profile he's extremely low and that's why it takes so long to develop these things you know well and I just want to make a function not a lot of programs as well that is the purpose of level and we want to provide medical x. and theological experts to answer your tough question so that we can have sound answer when this is our last question for the evening what can we expect from church experience after the quarantine period is over Pastor Mark I won't give back question to you quarantine has in many ways created within people of the desire for fellowship and you know if you have not then if you've been used to attending church and you're not attending church during this quarantine period there is that longing to be with Selby lead search that well going to pray together the same together and study the Word of God together. Also I think there are many people who feel touched by the Spirit of God during this time and they are looking for a communal a group a community religious experience I expect after cove at 19 is over that sure churches will be filled I really do and I expect that there will be a period of time that they'll be a spiritual renewal and this is an opportunity I believe to deeply study the Word of God to really have a state that is more than superficial more than emotional but it's faith that is anchored in Christ anchored in the Word of God And so I am very optimistic about the future I believe that God takes disasters like we've had him killed and 19 that God takes deal with difficult circumstances and he brings about out of them something positive God is still on the throne God is still suffering and I can't wait to see what God is going to do in the near future thank you so much has come our Yes and thank you both Dr Steve and Hafter Mark for joining us as our experts today it has been a fascinating discussion and discovery in that's a gaping the quarantine dilemma I am excited again like b.r.t. mentioned to again and now this next Sunday again the Federalists health attack fight back at 8 pm Eastern we are not going to want to miss out together meeting together and investigating this question and tell then we wish you God's blessings stay well stay healthy and stay happy.


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