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Secrets Unsealed

Women's Ordination Symposium

Stephen Bohr

1- Are You Sure? Issues and Answers

Laurel Damsteegt

2- The Impact of Spiritualism on Feminism and Gender Issues Today

Mario Veloso

3- From Mohaven to TOSC; How We Got Here

John Peters

4- Male Headship in the Old Testament

6- The Holy Kiss, Consumption of Alcohol, the Use of the Veil, and Personal Adornment

Eugene Prewitt

7- Straw Man Arguments in Favor of Women’s Ordination

Don Mackintosh

8- The Present Relevance of 1 Timothy

Jim Howard

9- The Third Option: A Way Forward or a Step Backwards?

11- Regional Ordination: A Path to Congregationalism?

Dojcin Zivadinovic

12- Reply to NAD and Other Pro-Women’s Ordination Arguments

Phil Mills

13- Women’s Ordination and the Jerusalem Council

14- The Present Relevance of 1 Timothy

Isaac Olatunji

15- Ellen White’s View of Women In Ministry

Julie Mesa

16- Male and Female Created He Them

C. Raymond Holmes

17- My Story and the Hermeneutical Question

19- The Priesthood of All Believers

Town Hall Meeting

We'd like to say we've had a wonderful time here at the Women's Symposium, and we're so glad that you have joined us today.

I have a group of wonderful gentlemen beside me here, and I'm going to let each 1 introduce themselves, but before we begin, I would just like to offer a word of prayer.

Kind Father in heaven, we are so privileged to be part of your people.

We don't understand all the wheels within wheels of your governance and your organization, but we're thankful that you are at the helm and that we can trust everything in you and that you have given us a guidebook that will very clearly tell us where we should be going.

So as we discuss this important topic, we ask for your Holy Spirit to be with us.

I'm from Berrien Springs, Michigan, and I'm very happy to be here with you.

I'm living now in Yucaipa, California, but originally I come from Chile.

My last work in the church was as an Associate Secretary of the General Conference.

Well my name is Stephen Boer, definitely not a good last name for a preacher.

And I'm the President of Secrets Unsealed and also the senior pastor of Fresno Central Seventh-day Adventist Church here in Fresno, California.

I sleep in my own bed during this symposium.

I'm Raymond Holmes, a retired seminary faculty member.

For 20 years, I live in the Upper Peninsula of Michigan.

In retirement, pastoring a small church, which is less than a mile from my last Lutheran church that I pastored.

I'm from Pennsylvania, originally from San Diego, California, and I'm a pastor in the Pennsylvania Conference.

I have served as an evangelist, as a pastor, and as a revivalist, and presently awaiting reassignment in ministry.

Hello, my name is Jim Howard, and I'm a pastor in the Michigan conference and thoroughly enjoying my time in California.

Hi, I'm Ingo Sorky, originally from Germany, but now living south of Dallas.

I'm a professor of religion at Southwestern Adventist University.

So gentlemen, we have lately heard from the seminary, Seventh-day Adventist seminary, that Christ is indeed head of the church and I don't think any of us would disagree with that.

But we also know that he has delegated his authority to his stewards here on Earth.

And this is what we're going to be discussing today, is the government of this body of believers, the Seventh-day Adventist Church.

And we would just like to begin by giving us a little background, a little history, to know where we've come from, how it all started.

Started with just a group of believers in 1844 who didn't need a government.

But very soon, things began to look like maybe we did need some government.

And so who would like to speak to the question?

First of all, give a brief history of the Seventh-day Adventist Church organization beginning in 1863, and then how things changed in 1901.

It is interesting when we think about the history of the Church, because we began without any organization, actually thinking that organization was not appropriate.

But you see, we soon discovered that we had a mission.

It took a little while for us to discover that, too.

But when we discovered that we have a mission, then you have to organize your army to conquer the world, because it was the whole world the objective of this mission.

And there was such a small group of people that was left after 1844 experience.

And a little over 50, thinking on the whole world, That is amazing.

But it was the Lord who was giving that mission.

And for the Lord, this world is very small.

So he did it once with 12, but why not with 53?

1863 was the year when we began to exist as an organized body.

From there on, many experiences finding the way to have it strong and well-established.

And we began with some units of organization.

The conferences came in, and also the general conference.

But as we grew, we needed an other kind of organization in the middle of the 2 we are talking.

And it took about half a century for us to get to the level of needing another layer of organization.

And that came in the General Conference of 1901.

And I'm going to refer a little bit to this session because at that time, a reorganization of the church came.

And the department of the church were organized in a very central way.

They were already working, many of the departments, but rather independently, 1 to each other, and some of them even from the central command.

And the unions were given some kind of autonomy to work.

Decisions could be made final at the union level.

Before, every decision from the church around the world was taken to the general conference.

And the general conference made up by just a few men.

So it developed a little bit of a kind of centralized power.

I will not use any other word that is being used around, because they have a critical element inside.

And then there was a need to decentralize the power coming closer to where the churches were.

This was given some power of decision within the unity of the body.

Some people today are talking about the power of the unions, which are final, and the general conference doesn't have any power to either command the unions or change whatever the union decides.

I read a book recently that this was the way the unions were established in 1901.

Because the way the unions worked through the years for a century, more than a century, without having any questions to the general conference.

I mean, it was within the unity of the whole body of the church, the world body.

And now they're coming with a few, I'm not talking about the whole unions, a few unions.

Because In the world, most of the places are just the same as it has been working since 1901 up to this day.

So this concept that The union has the power to command the church in that area without intervention from the general conference.

And in this, I'm including the division, because the division is an extension of the General Conference.

This is not from 1901 session, nor from the policies, neither from the philosophy of organization of the Church.

I should say theology, because this is closer to the reality.

And we are working as a body in the whole world.

And the authority of the Church is not in a few organizational bodies, but in the members of the Church.

Actually, what was done in 1901 was to call attention that the authority and power of the Church was based in the members.

And the General Conference in session because that is where the representation of the members of the church of the world is present.

Then, that is the highest power before God.

I mean, God is the highest and from there on the people, the members of the church.

So this is how it has been organized and It has been working very nicely so far.

And we hope that this will continue to be this way in the future.

Elder Veloso, it helps to keep in mind that Just as local churches are responsible for the discipline of local members, so are union conferences responsible for deciding who is qualified to be ordained to the gospel ministry.

However, just as local churches are not permitted to develop their own standards for the discipline of members and are obligated to adhere to the policies established by the Seventh Day Adventist Church Manual, which, of course, are voted by the General Conference in session, the same principle applies to the unions and ordination.

The world body of Seventh-day Adventists through the General Conference Working Policy is what decides on standards for pastoral ordination and the unions are obligated to adhere to those standards just as local churches are obligated to adhere to the church manual standards when it comes to the discipline of members.

And for those who might not be aware of it, on page 113 of the current edition of the General Conference Working Policy, the 1 that is dated for the years 2013 and 2014, in on that page of the General Conference Working Policy, it says that appointments to positions as chaplains, departmental directors, or pastors shall not be limited by race or color, neither shall these be limited by gender, except those requiring ordination to the gospel ministry.

I'd like to just back up just a minute back into the history a little bit.

Please somebody explain to me about the overall structure.

Are we like a hierarchy like the Roman Catholic Church?

Or sometimes you hear that being said, you know, like we have a pope and that.

How do we discuss and refer to the government of our church?

I don't want to answer your question, but I want to make an observation in the light of what Dr.

Series

Women's Ordination Symposium

11- Regional Ordination: A Path to Congregationalism?

Parent Series

Sponsor

Recorded

Other Teachings in Series

1- Are You Sure? Issues and Answers

1h 51m

2- The Impact of Spiritualism on Feminism and Gender Issues Today

57m

3- From Mohaven to TOSC; How We Got Here

57m

4- Male Headship in the Old Testament

57m

6- The Holy Kiss, Consumption of Alcohol, the Use of the Veil, and Personal Adornment

57m

7- Straw Man Arguments in Favor of Women’s Ordination

56m

8- The Present Relevance of 1 Timothy

1h 53m

9- The Third Option: A Way Forward or a Step Backwards?

58m

11- Regional Ordination: A Path to Congregationalism?

58m

12- Reply to NAD and Other Pro-Women’s Ordination Arguments

1h

13- Women’s Ordination and the Jerusalem Council

58m

14- The Present Relevance of 1 Timothy

1h 53m

15- Ellen White’s View of Women In Ministry

57m

16- Male and Female Created He Them

57m

17- My Story and the Hermeneutical Question

1h

19- The Priesthood of All Believers

57m

Town Hall Meeting

1h 56m

Sound Doctrine